Question re Death This Week in SoCal ...

[Peter Guy]

AzAt -- Thanks for the info and "whew" I'm glad I put in the qualifier "MAY" regarding the UK. And this is undoubtedly why PADI has a special UK waiver form!

 

[piffle]

Is there even such a thing as a solo certification?

 

[nilsdiver]

also, for the standard of normal Scuba practice, one might want to Google Rasmussen vs. Bendotti where the Court found that "buddy diving" was the industry standard and thus would create a rationale for liability IF this boat operator knowingly permitted solo diving in this situation.

Hi Peter, I tried to google Rasmussen vs. Bendotti and could not find it. Do you know what court the case was in? I wondering how binding this case would be in California. Because I think there is enough solo diving going on off of California boats that it would be hard to say that "buddy diving was the industry standard in Califorina".

Well I am personally pretty commit to team diving. I don't want any branch of the government telling me I can't solo dive. Or even ruling on industry standards and indirectly effecting want dive boats are will to allow based on potential liability and issuance issues. The dive boat should be for transportation and surface support. They have no business telling me how to do my dive.

 

[Thalassamania]

Yes, agree totally. However, at the same time, we're all adults and we should be able to make our own decisions and take whatever risks we deem acceptable to us. It's called freedom of choice.

If I were to want to go solo, trained and equipped properly or not, and if there are no laws against it, then who's the boat captain or dive master to say no? If they have standing policies on their boat, that's one thing (and take the risk of losing all the businesses from solo divers and divers who don't want babysitters).

On the other hand, do we need to have the various countries' governments making more mommy/nanny/babysitter laws to rule our lives by?

That's why we get trained and get certified. The Open Water C-Card isn't the be-all-end-all, but the course definitely covers the hazard of solo diving among other hazards. And if the "adult" certified diver were divert from his or her training, then that's on that individual's head.

PS I've been on the Spectre boat plenty of times and they ran a safe boating operation. Their divemaster even fished me out of the water one time when my BC malfunctioned and gotten full of water. If the boat didn't leave me floating in the water and left for port or run aground or floundered, as far as I'm concerned, the boat company did its oatjob.

The boat may be great and they may have done nothing wrong.

But as far as your "right" to "take whatever risks we deem acceptable to us. It's called freedom of choice." - only after you've put up sufficient cash to cover the search for you, your rescue or recovery, transport to the chamber or morgue, etc. Insurance does not cut it, because if it has to pay out that costs everyone else. When you are completely self sufficient and are not subsidized by anyone else in any way, then you get to have complete and utter freedom of choice.

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

Is there even such a thing as a solo certification?

Yes. But to get it, you have to study on your own and leave the instructor on the beach each time you dive

Seriously, there is at least one agency offering a solo cert. Maybe SDI? Can't remember.

Best wishes.

 

[tc]

Is there even such a thing as a solo certification?

Yes-

International Training :: Get Certified :: Solo Diver Course

 

[AzAtty]

AzAt -- Thanks for the info and "whew" I'm glad I put in the qualifier "MAY" regarding the UK. And this is undoubtedly why PADI has a special UK waiver form!

I was down at the law library while reading the thread, so I hit the books. My knee-jerk reaction was identical to yours, so I was quite surprised to find that the common law has been modified in merry old England. I was kind of hoping that Alex777 would chime in on the topic since he's more of an authority in that area than either of us.

Hi Peter, I tried to google Rasmussen vs. Bendotti and could not find it. Do you know what court the case was in? I wondering how binding this case would be in California. Because I think there is enough solo diving going on off of California boats that it would be hard to say that "buddy diving was the industry standard in Califorina".

I posted the entire citation in a thread from several years ago. Look at my old posts in the liability threads and you'll find the reference and some citations to California cases.

EDIT: Here's the post, on Google, even: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/578732-post51.html. Dig up the entire thread for the discussion.

 

[wedivebc]

Is there even such a thing as a solo certification?

Yes SDI offers a recreational level solo diver course and ANDI offers a tech level one.

 

[princessaprilia]

This story reminds me of a conversation I had recently with another woman who has been diving for a few years now, but only on vacations (around 25 dives in 5 years).

I was complaining about a shore dive that my husband & I had to call due to equipment failure. She then asked me why I didn't just go diving without him. I'm positive that I stared at her like she had just grown a new head, and then said that I am in no way near experienced enough to dive solo. She said that she would have gone, what bad could have happened?

I was speechless. Confused. So many things were swimming in my head (and none of them were solo), but all I could blurt out was that I could get tangled in all the fishing line we saw on the first 2 dives. She waived it off, and said that was why she only did boat dives, they were safer.

That whole conversation still shakes me up when I think of it.

 

[pwfletcher]

Interesting responses to my original post ...

1. It seems like the popular response to my first question is: no, the dive boat captain should not be held legally liable.

2. Conversely, the general consensus regarding my second question is: no, if it was my boat, I would not let a diver with 14 dives jump off solo.

This is interesting because no one wants to hold the captain to a standard of care that requires him to inquire as to a solo diver's ability ... yet the standard of care established by the responses to second question, in which most here would not allow inexperienced solo diving off their boat, mandates that a captain in such a situation refuse to let such a diver disembark solo. It is a tough issue and the result is exactly as I anticipated ... contradictory and without resolution.