Removing spring from Halcyon manifold

[Bismark]

Anyone know of the potential downside of removing the small springs located just under the slotted screws inside the rubber valve knobs on a Halcyon 300bar isolation manifold? My valves were quite difficult to turn even though they were almost new. I took them apart to service them and don't see a real problem with leaving this spring out. Sure turns a heck of a lot easier and doesn't waggle around or anything without the spring. Any thoughts here? My Thermo valves on other tanks turn very slickly but until I removed these springs, even when freshly cleaned and "christo lubed" they were fairly stiff. Appreciate any comments. No I am not cave diving and worrying about rolling them closed.

 

[do it easy]

Yeah, that spring keeps tension on the stem o-ring when your valves are off. Removing that spring will allow crud into the valve. You can somewhat adjust the tension by not cranking down the little slotted nut that traps the spring, although you do want to make sure it's secure.

 

[Bismark]

I am not a mechanical genius but I still don't understand. Please have paitence with me here. Some other valves on my buddies doubles do not have springs at all (??) The spring is on the outside of the valve knob, meaning that there is a piece of the valveknob itself between the spring and the valve stem. When I took the spring out and tightened up the slotted screw that you can reach from the outside with a slotted screwdriver, the valve knob itself stays tight but the knob is much easier to turn. There does not appear to be any movement in the valve knob before or after removing the spring and there is no mechanical connection between the spring and the valve stem itself. Also, I could see that the spring would keep tension between the screw and the valve knob but I just tightened up the screw more. I am the kind of guy who takes something apart and always have spare parts left over when I reassemble it..... Just don't want any safety issues here. Thanks again for the patience.

 

[Soggy]

Since this is the DIR forum and you mentioned that you are not a cave diver and are not worried about rolling your valves off...

Fundamental to the concept of DIR is that it can be used in all, or at least most environments without modification. Additionally, there are many open water environments where a roll off can occur including simply descending down an anchor line to a wreck. Additionally, gear should be easily used by any teammate. I sure don't want to be using someone's tanks that are missing parts.

Valves will be a little more difficult to turn when the tanks are full than when they are low on gas, but they aren't *that* hard to turn unless you have a bent stem or something. There is absolutely no reason why you would need to leave the spring out.

On top of that, generally speaking, it's a bad idea to leave out parts that are in every valve I've ever seen.

 

[do it easy]

The spring puts pressure on the slotted nut, which in turn pulls the stem out. Without the spring and the valve in the off position (and probably no reg in place), the stem will probably be loose and let crapola into the valve.

If you put a reg on the valve and open the valve, the pressure in the valve will force the stem out and seal the stem o-ring.

No spring, no pressure... no seal. It might seem to work without the spring in there, but this is certainly not how they were designed to be used.

As far as safety issues go, I think we burned that bridge a few posts ago. The internet is not the place to learn about valve maintenance.

These posts are for entertainment purposes only! If anything bad happens, I am not liable. You and you alone are liable.

 

[Bismark]

Soggy,
Maybe I wasn't 100% clear here. What does the spring actually do? As I mentioned, my buddies HP 120's do not have them in his valves. It just seems to make it easier and smoother to turn. Also, don't worry, I won't be schlepping my steel hp 130's from Vancouver Island down to Cave country

Soggy, just got do it easy's post. All is clear now. Still not carrying 120lbs to Florida..... Thanks again.

Cheers,

 

[Bismark]

Just got your last post do it easy. Thanks for the explanation. I understand what you are talking about now. Where do I apply for my internet equipment maintenance cert? Thanks again.

 

[Soggy]

Soggy,
Maybe I wasn't 100% clear here. What does the spring actually do?

I think Do It Easy provided a good answer.

As I mentioned, my buddies HP 120's do not have them in his valves.

What kind of valve does he have? Even the J-valves I have sitting around have a spring in them. Every thermo valve has them, too.

Also, don't worry, I won't be schlepping my steel hp 130's from Vancouver Island down to Cave country

Did you even read my post? Caves are irrelevant to the roll-off issue.

You haven't provided a single good reason to remove a part from the valve. Everyone else in the world seems to manage just fine with all the manufacturer's parts in them.

 

[Bismark]

Soggy, yes I did read your post. Looks like you didn't read my first post and notice the tounge in cheek reference to cave diving. I certainly wasn't trying to make offence about the cave thing. Also, Do it Easy did provide an excellent answer. (see above). I will find out what kind of valves my buddy has, should be interesting to see. Maybe someone took the springs out of his? I guess I wasn't clear enough with my first post though as I wasn't trying to find a "single good reason to remove a part of the valve" but because they appeared to work without springs I wanted to know what they did. Again, Do it easy cleared that part up for me. As far as the rest of the world,.... well I don't really know everyone else so I can't say......