dumpsterDiver
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Shoulder Pull Dump?
- Thread starter guyharrisonphoto
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What I'm hearing so far is that there many divers diving so negatively bouyant that twenty pounds of lift are needed to surface.
I too started diving when horse collars were an option, my first one being more like the type found under your seat in an airplane.
I love my current BC it is a fantastic device that helps me to remain neutral in the water but as the name implies it is a bouyancy compensator not a lift bag.
If my BC were to fail completely I wouldn't have a problem surfacing without it.
I rarely have more than a few shots of air in it unless I'm relaxing on the surface waiting for the boat, then and only then will I have it inflated to keep me surfaced.
I know this thread is becoming a for or against discussion with everyone having good and valid reasons for their choices, just remember that it is a matter of preference based on personal needs, desires or requirements.
I too started diving when horse collars were an option, my first one being more like the type found under your seat in an airplane.
I love my current BC it is a fantastic device that helps me to remain neutral in the water but as the name implies it is a bouyancy compensator not a lift bag.
If my BC were to fail completely I wouldn't have a problem surfacing without it.
I rarely have more than a few shots of air in it unless I'm relaxing on the surface waiting for the boat, then and only then will I have it inflated to keep me surfaced.
I know this thread is becoming a for or against discussion with everyone having good and valid reasons for their choices, just remember that it is a matter of preference based on personal needs, desires or requirements.
DMDavid, where you are diving, it is both possible and desirable to remain near neutral throughout the water column, with minimal use of the BC.
If you are diving Puget Sound, in 14 mm of neoprene, or diving dry, you can lose a great deal of buoyancy at deeper depths. It is quite simply not possible to compensate for neoprene compression or a flooded dry suit with one's lungs. In this case, a nonfunctioning BC means a nasty swim to the surface, especially if using large tanks, or the dumping of ditchable weight, which means significant difficulty controlling the last portion of the ascent. For me, avoiding the possibility of a complete failure of buoyancy compensation is a reasonable goal.
If you are diving Puget Sound, in 14 mm of neoprene, or diving dry, you can lose a great deal of buoyancy at deeper depths. It is quite simply not possible to compensate for neoprene compression or a flooded dry suit with one's lungs. In this case, a nonfunctioning BC means a nasty swim to the surface, especially if using large tanks, or the dumping of ditchable weight, which means significant difficulty controlling the last portion of the ascent. For me, avoiding the possibility of a complete failure of buoyancy compensation is a reasonable goal.
You are absolutely correct..
I'm looking at this BC issue from the view point of a warm water diver and I neglected to take into account those that dive with drysuits or very thick wetsuits.
I can see now where the loss of lift from the BC could indeed be life threatening.
Sometimes I forget that I'm not on the Florida Divers forum and that keeps me from looking at the bigger picture.
Lobzilla
Contributor
When I first used the Halcyon Eclipse I had the same thoughts due to the very short inflator hose. However, often the problem is that the wing sits to high and the left chest ring is too low. Check that before thinking about adding stuff that can fail.
The advantage of the conventional method of raising the hose is that your left shoulder invevitably goes up too. You will 'automatically' pitch up and roll to the right a little and that is what you need to get the last bit of air out of the small doughnut wings (without using the butt dump).
The advantage of the conventional method of raising the hose is that your left shoulder invevitably goes up too. You will 'automatically' pitch up and roll to the right a little and that is what you need to get the last bit of air out of the small doughnut wings (without using the butt dump).
Although I cannot see any pro for using a shoulder pull dump it is available for Halcyon wings (at least in Europe). It's CE-approved (important for the European Bureaucrats).
Background: The German CMAS-branch (VDST) decided that in the instructor training courses the trainers and students have to have a shoulder dump valve. So all Halcyon wings couldn't be used any longer. The European Halcyon distributor BtS decided to offer an inflatorhose with shoulder dump. It took a while because every model of Halcyon wings had to be tested. Since last year it's CE-approved and available at Halcyon dealers in Europe.
I don't know whether it's available in the US.
Summary what EU brought to divers:
- Use of M26x2 threads on Nitrox tanks and regulators (O2 more than 21%)
- the little toggle thingy at the lower OPV
- to be continued......
Background: The German CMAS-branch (VDST) decided that in the instructor training courses the trainers and students have to have a shoulder dump valve. So all Halcyon wings couldn't be used any longer. The European Halcyon distributor BtS decided to offer an inflatorhose with shoulder dump. It took a while because every model of Halcyon wings had to be tested. Since last year it's CE-approved and available at Halcyon dealers in Europe.
I don't know whether it's available in the US.
Summary what EU brought to divers:
- Use of M26x2 threads on Nitrox tanks and regulators (O2 more than 21%)
- the little toggle thingy at the lower OPV
- to be continued......
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