Technically-minded Wannabe Diver

[TheQuantumFishe]

:doctor: I am a technically-minded person, interested in becoming a certified diver..

My question is this: Is it possible to get a type of diving-equivalent to aircraft "type ratings" (in which one would be certified on specific pieces of equipment), and bypass the usual OC certification; or is this step mandatory?

Ther reason I am asking is that, after reading about Open Circuit, Semi Closed Rebreather, and Closed Circuit Rebreather apparatus, it seems to me that , at least for me, I'd rather make one investment in one type of gear, keep it for a number of years, and upgrade to something more advanced when it becomes available.

I have no aversion to doing the standard open-water/OC stuff, it's just that I'm not planning on buying any of my own gear that will be OC when more mature technology is available for underwater life support.

Thank you for your replies.

Warm regards,
Stephen Brown
Traverse City, Michigan

 

[JimC]

I beleive most agencies will require O/W among other certifications such as Nitrox rebreather training.

Just like you can't take lessons to drive a school bus without a valid licence for a car.

The minimums on very simple "rec" rebreathers from PADI:

- A PADI Advance Open Water Diver (or equivalent) or PADI Open Water Diver (or equivelent) with proof of at least 10 logged dive beyond training divers for certification.
- Certified as a PADI Enriched Air Diver (or equivalent, which is defined as proof of enriched air certification that qualifies the diver to use any blend up to 40 percent oxygen)
- At least 15 years old

 

[Spectre]

I'm not quite sure I understand your question fully. Are you saying that you are looking to get, say, rebreather training and bypass Open Water? Or are you saying you would care not to purchase open circuit gear and then throw it all away on a rebreather later?

You definately will need Open Water training before you can get rebreather certification [as well as nitrox].

Sure, you _could_ rent open circuit stuff until you get to a point that you can get rebreather training. However you'll need experience before moving towards rebreathers. In order to get a good amount of diving experience you'll end up paying more in rental fees than it would have cost to purchase everything.

Now I've heard arguments comparing the cost of a rebreather vs. the cost of a doubles setup, which is more indicative of _when_ in a diving career you would start looking into rebreather training.

 

[herman]

Hi Stephen and welcome to the board.

I don't dive a rebreather and have limited experience with them but let me give you my feeling on this. First, as best as I can tell, rebreathers are not a "mature" piece of equipment, at least not in the rec diver market. Beyond that, there is a lot more to diving than strapping on a tank and going. There are many skills, not the least of which is bouyancy control, that are critical to diving safely. The only way for you to aquire and hone these skills to the level you need to dive safely is by getting good instruction on the skill and then practicing them a lot. From what I have read about rebreathers, they require a lot of attention to detail and constant monitoring to dive safely. In diving, we talk about task loading or how much stuff we can handle at one time. Most new divers have almost as much task loading as they can handle with just the basics for a good many dives. It would seem to me, the combination of a new diver and a rebreather is begging for another dead diver.

My suggestion, get your OW,AOW,Rescue and Nitrox certs, get in 100+ dives, then if you still want one, get a rebreather.

 

[MikeFerrara]

IANTD allows the introduction of a rebreather at the OW level. The course in considerably longer of course. You are still required to do some of the dives on open circiut.

 

[Northeastwrecks]

Even if you can take a course like that mentioned by MikeFerrera (and I do not doubt that he is correct), you should not consider trying to jump directly into a rebreather without getting more experience in basic underwater skills.

Using your analogy of "type ratings" in aircraft, no pilot jumps directly into an F-16 without knowing the basics. Even military pilots start in trainers.

When you get in the water, you will find yourself in a new, potentially hostile, environment. Things that seem easy on dry land or on the surface become difficult underwater. In addition, you need to develop a new set of instinctive reactions, i.e., mask replacement and clearing, recovering regulator, switching regulators, buoyancy control, etc.... Failing to properly perform any of these basic tasks quickly and efficiently may result in serious problems for you and your buddy.

Open circuit scuba is relatively basic. Assuming proper maintenance and setup, it is generally quite reliable. Moreover, adhering to recreational limits, particularly those suggested for new divers without more training, will help you emerge from the water under your own power.

Rebreathers add levels of complexity to the equation. You no longer need to simply breathe through a reg. Instead, you have more complicated setups, more planning and more potential for error. Malfunctions in a rebreather can cause it to provide an incorrect mix, which will further impair you. It can even kill you if you get a hypoxic mix or too much CO2. Rebreathers can fail if you get water in the system. My understanding is that the failure consists of generating a "caustic cocktail" that can injure your lungs.

Rebreathers are also limiting in certain circumstances. For example, I'm diving a U-Boat this weekend in about 130 fsw. One of the guys in my group is a former military diver who uses a rebreather. He'll be on open circuit because he tells me that his rebreather isn't to be used that deep. In other words, you might find it limiting unless you buy one of the very expensive (approx. $7,500.00) models (RB80 comes to mind) that is rated for deeper depths.

Finally, it is my understanding that the bailout systems on a rebreather are all open circuit systems. In other words, you will need to know how to handle open circuit if your rebreather malfunctions.

IMHO, you should start with Open Circuit. Consider buying your equipment, enjoy it and learn to handle the basics before you add unnecessary complexity.

To all you rebreather divers. I'm not knocking rebreathers. I've even considered getting one (my buddy's is for sale). I decided to wait until I am more experienced (like after I've become trimix certified) before tackling one of those things. So please let me know if I'm wrong (like I need to ask for that on this Board).

 

[Scuba446]

Northeastwrecks,
I don't get it -whats the big attraction to rebreathers anways? What real advantage do they give a diver in that he wants to assume more risk than is already necessary?

??

 

[Northeastwrecks]

Scuba446 once bubbled...
Northeastwrecks,
I don't get it -whats the big attraction to rebreathers anways? What real advantage do they give a diver in that he wants to assume more risk than is already necessary?

??

My reason was that I wanted to be able to extend my bottom time. The rebreather will allow you to stay down for a very long time.

However, you are depth limited and, more importantly, you will outlast your buddy unless he/she is also on a rebreather. Finally, my wreck instructors reminded me that, in my area, most boat dives are less than 90 minutes. I can get that with a good set of doubles.

I'd be interested in hearing from some rebreather divers as I my comments are based on research, not on actual experience with rebreathers.

 

[Scuba446]

Seems that when I hear of a divers death, at least 50% of the time its due to a rebreather.

Why would anyone want to spend $5,000+ for something so dangerous, when they can buy a set of twins, and dive safer, for 1/5th of the cost?

Guess I must be missing something here.

Oh yea, maybe its the bubble-less feature they offer?


??????

 

[Scuba446]

Maybe rebreather companies should start putting the old skill & crossbones on their rigs, kinda like the WARNING labels we see for POISONOUS chemicals!