Not a stupid question at all. If you dive enough, you'll come across OOA divers. If I had only rescued OOA buddies, I wouldn't know if OOA divers usually went for the reg in your mouth or not.
Secondary reg bungee'd around neck?
- Thread starter rjpv
- Start date
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Age
Contributor
Well, I hope you don't ever mix up the Air 2 with a snorkel on the spur of the moment, that would be fun
For me, it's all or nothing; I want to be able to use my equipment like it's part of me, without wondering what configuration I'm wearing today.
But divers are also trained to NOT go OOA and not to panic, so if they actually stuck by "how they were trained" this wouldn't be a concern other than in the less than 1/10th of 1% of catasrophic gear failure. Yet, it is.
Really? You'd rather have a panicky diver right in your face in full blown panic? With 7' hose it's not like they're gonna swim off on you. It's enough hose that the other diver doesn't have to yank on you every time he wants to inhale, but not much more than needed to be two feet away from you and directly facing each other. If needed, you can "reel in" the diver and keep him closer if the situation warrants.
GrumpyOldGuy
Contributor
I am swapping to the long hose with a bunged backup for 2 of the less mentioned reasons. First, although I have neve been OOA nor have my buddies, I have had my primary kicked out 2x (we dive a tight 3 some, it happens) once with a mask removed with the same fin. Having an alternate second on my neck is easier than fumbling around for my primary. Second, the octo clipped low seems to get hung up on things easy and can get dragged through the sand if it gets unclipped. Not likely with a bungy.
Age
Contributor
Imagine being caught in a down current and getting an unplanned deco obligation. I don't care who you are, you could get OOA.
"Really? You'd rather have a panicky diver right in your face in full blown panic? With 7' hose it's not like they're gonna swim off on you. It's enough hose that the other diver doesn't have to yank on you every time he wants to inhale, but not much more than needed to be two feet away from you and directly facing each other. If needed, you can "reel in" the diver and keep him closer if the situation warrants".[/QUOTE]
Okay, this makes more sense to me, except the reeling in bit. Big chance of yanking the reg. out of his or her mouth don't you think?
Ì think most of the major point have been covered but I want to point out a couple of things concerning "the triangle" and "short hoses.
the triangle taught by many agencies is from the mouth to the lower corner of the rib cage, right? If you and your buddy are horizontal and at the same depth as you should be, most of that triangle is out of view. Given that everyone clips those octos in a slightly different way in a slightly different spot, just where the heck is it? This whole thing was designed with kneeling or otherwise vertical divers in mind. Just refernce the text from about any agency, watch it being taught or think back to your own class. By contrast, the mouth of a horizontal diver is in clear view and easy enough to find in zero vis.
I use a long hose in OW but not because I think you really need a long hose to share air in OW. I use it because the hose is routed close to my body and eliminates the unsightly drag inducing, snag prone loop created by a 36 or 40 inch hose...which, while short, is too long to do a good job of routing directly from the 1st stage to the divers mouth. Again, just look at some divers with those big ugly loops of hose sticking out and compare it to a diver with a long hose routed properly and a short bungied backup. The long hose with necklaced backup leaves NOTHING sticking out beyond the outline of the divers body.
Slightly off topic but same goes for the long HP hoses that divers put consols on...leaves a big ugly loop on the left. While it matches the two big ugly loops on the right, there just isn't any need for it. I put my spg and only my spg on a hose just long enough to reach my left hip where it gets clipped. There isn't anything about a compass, depth guage, computer or bottom timer that makes the end of an HP hose a good place to put them. Doing so just gives you cause to use a hose that's way too long to be streamline.
LOL, what folks tend to refer to as the "standard" configuration lookes like a big knot or birds nest with all the loops.
the triangle taught by many agencies is from the mouth to the lower corner of the rib cage, right? If you and your buddy are horizontal and at the same depth as you should be, most of that triangle is out of view. Given that everyone clips those octos in a slightly different way in a slightly different spot, just where the heck is it? This whole thing was designed with kneeling or otherwise vertical divers in mind. Just refernce the text from about any agency, watch it being taught or think back to your own class. By contrast, the mouth of a horizontal diver is in clear view and easy enough to find in zero vis.
I use a long hose in OW but not because I think you really need a long hose to share air in OW. I use it because the hose is routed close to my body and eliminates the unsightly drag inducing, snag prone loop created by a 36 or 40 inch hose...which, while short, is too long to do a good job of routing directly from the 1st stage to the divers mouth. Again, just look at some divers with those big ugly loops of hose sticking out and compare it to a diver with a long hose routed properly and a short bungied backup. The long hose with necklaced backup leaves NOTHING sticking out beyond the outline of the divers body.
Slightly off topic but same goes for the long HP hoses that divers put consols on...leaves a big ugly loop on the left. While it matches the two big ugly loops on the right, there just isn't any need for it. I put my spg and only my spg on a hose just long enough to reach my left hip where it gets clipped. There isn't anything about a compass, depth guage, computer or bottom timer that makes the end of an HP hose a good place to put them. Doing so just gives you cause to use a hose that's way too long to be streamline.
LOL, what folks tend to refer to as the "standard" configuration lookes like a big knot or birds nest with all the loops.
I find the bungied back-up a much better configuration for diving then other more common rigs. While I guide and teach many new divers for a living- which means I get to see some very good divers and some very, very bad ones. I have probably had to share air or had to deal with more OOA divers than the average diver and the long hose makes it much easier and in my experience about 50% of a good sized sample went for the reg in my mouth. As Mike pointed out also if you are in a properly trimmed position the "triangle" as taught is not in the divers line of site unless he is below you.
Age
Contributor
Actually there is one reason that will become more compelling as you get older when you get too shortsighted to read the damn things up close.
Why it is a good idea to bungie your secondary as oppsed to having it hanging on your hip or strap or actually floating around as many many Divers do. ( ya do not belive me...watch divers gearing up and count how many times there life support systems gets dragged, knocked or worse snagged on something prior to getting in the water. And as they swim around a wreck or reef. Knock it here and there.)
The most simplistic reason I can offer is this. The bungied secondary is the safest place to have it. It stays safe. Stays out of the dirt. Cannot get ripped off its resting place. Does not and will not hamper your streamlined configuration or attempts there of. It is a guranteeed place to find it. When you need it.
Now lets look at the STANDARD configuration - as it has been pointed out. The octo drags in the dirt. Hoses flapping in the current. risks of entanglements IF you desire to do a swim though penetrate a wreck inspect a reef. Is hanging loose...falls out, can and will get entangled at some point. Divers are oblivious as to where there gear is hanging or not hanging. The octo and the CLUSTER SPG gets dragged along the dirt dammaging coral, wrecks and the gear itself. Dirt gets lodge in the orifices of the Octo thus does not gurantee a first breath in the event of an OOA.
I have seen it time and time again. The dragging octo and SPG just floating in the current.
The most simplistic reason I can offer is this. The bungied secondary is the safest place to have it. It stays safe. Stays out of the dirt. Cannot get ripped off its resting place. Does not and will not hamper your streamlined configuration or attempts there of. It is a guranteeed place to find it. When you need it.
Now lets look at the STANDARD configuration - as it has been pointed out. The octo drags in the dirt. Hoses flapping in the current. risks of entanglements IF you desire to do a swim though penetrate a wreck inspect a reef. Is hanging loose...falls out, can and will get entangled at some point. Divers are oblivious as to where there gear is hanging or not hanging. The octo and the CLUSTER SPG gets dragged along the dirt dammaging coral, wrecks and the gear itself. Dirt gets lodge in the orifices of the Octo thus does not gurantee a first breath in the event of an OOA.
I have seen it time and time again. The dragging octo and SPG just floating in the current.
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