Agency comparisons

[sewcopp]

In NAUI is Master Diver a pre-requisite for any other courses. No one here instructs NAUI only ACUC, PADI, and SDI/TDI so it's hard to get the full scoop. I believe in PADI Master is a stepping stone to Advanced and that is a pre-requisite for Dive MAster..... The

Don't read my last post incorrectly I said in some of the aganecies Advanced Divers need between 4-6 specialties. It is each of these that needs aroung 4 dives (that 16-24 required dives) each also has required class times bring that total up as well. My take on it is some agancies put the specialities for an Advanced (or Master if that is what the agency calls that level) diver all together in one course and you do the whole thing together, and others break it down into little blocks that you pay for individually and get a collection of cards. Then when you finish the right number you can apply for another card (another registration fee) and call yourself an Advanced Diver.

It seems to be the old lumper or splitter arguement. It's a matter of preference and what's available locally whether you want to have 5-7 cards (and pay individual registration fees for each) or 1 card (and 1 registration fee) to get basically the same training.

From what I can tell so far SDI/TDI, PADI are splitters and ACUC and NAUI are lumpers.


Sue

 

[scubatexastony]

I don't know about Lumping and Splitting, sounds like a timber division term , but as TAVI and I have pointed out, the NAUI MD course is definately more than just doing the dives. If you decide to go Pro with NAUI, the knowledge review test and a major portion of the final exams will be from the MD text. It MUST be passed with a minimum of 75% and the Instructor/Instructor Trainer/Course Director can and will sometimes require a higher score. Find a good teacher and take the course, you'll be glad you did, and will have the diving knowledge (sans the secret handshake of some agencies) of a dive leader.

tony

 

[sewcopp]

Tony lumpers and splitters refer to the naming tendencies and categorizations in many different fields. I first found the terms when talking informally in a biological taxonomy course, having nothing to do with forestry or timber. Just think about the words. yah NAUI sounds like a lumper. Put the info., dives, and examinations into 1 course (lumped) and not require people to take (pay for) numerous separate courses to get the same information peicemeal.

Peicemeal is good for some but it is more expensive and allows the use of more shortterm memory. Possibly giving less longterm retention, you definately have to work harder to get the info to stay. (I think we call that personal review and personal experience). Let's be honest if we're not instructing how many of us, generally as divers, will actually do that.

Sue

 

[Louma]

Hi Sue, I'm a NAUI Instructer (I do have Advanced through PADI and my wife is PADI). The minimum progression to Instructor is OW - AOW - Master Diver eihter DM or Asst. Instructor - then Instructor. However, everyone that I know has to pick up a few specialities along the way most have Rescue, NITROX and in my shops case (New Jersey) wreck diving both external and penetration.

I admit that the Instructer is an important consideration. The PADI instructor I had for advanced was absolutely great!! I learned a lot from him and the course. He is a retired Navy diver with over 30 years experiance. I still go back and dive with him a few times a year in Key West.

However, the LDS is also important. I feel a great example of this is the Dive Shop in NJ that I got most of my certifications, the owner would not let anyone advance any further if he didn't think you were ready. For example I spent 5 years at Master Diver before I took the Dive Master course. I stayed at Dive Master 3 years before taking the Instructor. Needless to say I had hundreds of dives under my belt buy doing it this way. Talk about learning your craft!

Now, let's get back to picking an Instructor. Do you want one with almost a thousand dives in all types of conditions or do you want one that got his Instructor certification in the min. of 1 year and 100 dives?

 

[markfm]

For PADI, Master Diver is not a PADI requirement to go to Divemaster training.
OW -- AOW -- Rescue -- Divemaster gets you to the bottom profesional rung of the ladder in PADI.

OW -- AOW -- Rescue -- 5 Specialties -- Master Diver represents the "top" (quotes purposeful) non-pro PADI cert.

You have to have a certain number of logged dives to qualify for either Master Diver or Divemaster, but they really are separate things.

Master Diver = take enough specialties, get enough dives, and MD pops out (OK, send another dollar in). Depending on your instructor, you can count the AOW specialty dives ( a sampler of different things) towards the individual specialties (helps towards completion of the requirements)

Divemaster = an actual course of instruction in and of itself, learning to work with people, help in classes, mapping project, physical skills tests plus bookwork,...

I've only taken drysuit and Nitrox specialties, but am working towards Divemaster. At various training centers you can supposedly rack out a DM fairly quickly, but where I live it's spread out over multiple months, assisting with classes, some specialty pool work to do presentation skills, a few dry classes to discuss things, etc. There's a lot to it, including learning the ropes -- in my class this is where the Instructor gets to play tricks on you, things like turning off your air, to see how quickly you adapt, how well you react. I had thought (still do) that Rescue was a super class, but DM really moves it up another notch, breadth and depth of what you learn to do.

As others have said, the Instructor makes a huge difference. I'm very fortunate, the shop I use is excellent, and my Instructor is focused on mentoring us, not just knocking things out fast to maximize $.

 

[nyprrthd]

Hello everyone. I started this thread, and have read all of the replies. Since I'm the one who asked the question(s), I've just been following the thread (lurking) as it has developed. Thanks to everyone who has participated. I've learned quite a bit about some of the actual and perceived differences in the agencies. Seems to me that it still boils down to the competency and diligence of the instructor. That, and a diver who truly wants to learn the skills, and isn't in a hurry to rack up cards and titles. Personally, I just want to dive safely, and enjoy this great pastime.

Oh yeah....... thanks for not turing it into another PADI (or other agency) bashing session.

BTW, we'll be at the Beneath the Sea show at the Meadowlands on Saturday. If anyone wants to hook up for a cup of coffee with me and my DW, send me a PM.

 

[LSDeep]

The best advise, once again, is to research instructors. After all most will agree that they are the ones that make it or break it, not the agency.

you have my full support there!!! the actual agency is secondary, you want to make sure that your instr. knows what he is doing. so save yourself the time to research agencies into detail, spend it on researching the instr you want to take a course from.