Air2 nipple too large

[beanojones]

I don't know.



I don't have the data, but there's an easy experiment you can do. Take two identical BCs, one with a regular LPI and one with an Air II. Hook them up to identical tanks filled to identical pressures with identical regulators. One of the regs will, of course, have the Air II hose and connector. Fill both BCs with air as fast as you can. Use a stop watch to see how quickly they fill from completely empty until the over pressure valve starts to release air. Do it several times just to make sure once wasn't a fluke. Tell us what you find.

That actually has more to do with Scubapro's fill rate with it's inflator on the Air2. Their "Balanced Inflator" inflator is also similarly much faster than any inflator that has an internal Schrader valve. One of the reasons for the popularity of the "K" inflator (and the Scubapro "Balanced Inflator") in the tropical tech community is that it is not built around an internal Schraeder valve. Schraeder based valves simply do not have the flow rate to fill a large bladder quickly enough in the event of a buoyancy failure to prevent problems.

Disclaimer: I have not tested all possible inflators. But until now, the slow ones were all Schraeder based, and the fast ones were all non-Schraeder based.

 

[knowone]

Only experienced that situation once.

Like thumbs, an inch and a half long.


Thanks for repairing the board board.

**:sblogo:**

********* No1 for fun **********

 

[redacted]

That actually has more to do with Scubapro's fill rate with it's inflator on the Air2. Their "Balanced Inflator" inflator is also similarly much faster than any inflator that has an internal Schrader valve. One of the reasons for the popularity of the "K" inflator (and the Scubapro "Balanced Inflator") in the tropical tech community is that it is not built around an internal Schraeder valve. Schraeder based valves simply do not have the flow rate to fill a large bladder quickly enough in the event of a buoyancy failure to prevent problems.

Disclaimer: I have not tested all possible inflators. But until now, the slow ones were all Schraeder based, and the fast ones were all non-Schraeder based.

I am with Walter that the issue is with the restricted flow rate at the hose connection supporting the integrated octo. The Scubapro balanced power inflator (same BC inflate mechanism as an Air2) as well as the "K" inflators all use the standard inflator hose which uses a schradder valve. All manufacturers of combined octo/inflators use a different hose with no schradder valve.

 

[beanojones]

I am with Walter that the issue is with the restricted flow rate at the hose connection supporting the integrated octo. The Scubapro balanced power inflator (same BC inflate mechanism as an Air2) as well as the "K" inflators all use the standard inflator hose which uses a schradder valve. All manufacturers of combined octo/inflators use a different hose with no schradder valve.

Here's what I am saying though:

The Air2 fill test he suggested as evidence of the Schraeder in the hose being the restriction is (probably) a test of a Non Schraeder inflator (the one inside the Air2) against a Schraeder inflator (the average inflator other than the Scubapro Balanced inflator, and the "K" inflator).

If you test a Scubapro Balanced inflator (which uses a standard inflator hose with a Schraeder in it) against an Air2 (which uses the non-Schrader hose) you will see that their fill rates are nearly identical. Which says that the Schraeder in the hose is not the source of slow BCD filling, rather it is the Schraeder inside the typical inflator (which is not usually fully depressed, thus not fully open in the inflator internals).

Like I said, we tropical tech guys diving in steel all around, and in wetsuits, need really, really fast inflators for our redundant bladders, so we actually played around with this stuff. We even went to far as to switch the nipple on our inflators to use Air2 hoses thinking that thet would help, but we found that the difference came from the inflator internals, and not from the hose internals.

It seems that the inflator hose Schraeder is fully depressed by a (non corroded) inflator nipple, so it ends up not being the thing restricting fill speed for the BCD. The Schraeder internal to many inflator designs, however is not fully depressed even with the full travel of the fill button on the inflator, and thus does restrict the speed of fill.

(FOr most divers, and in most circumstances, a slower filling inflator would be better for safety. For us, all we cared about was the inflator's fill speed, for safety. If the primary bladder failed when we had four steel tanks and only a .5 mil suit for buoyancy, we would sink like stones. So we actually checked all this stuff out.)

 

[cmburch]

I have a DiveRite inflator Octo. A fitting can be obtained for it, so it can be used with a Reg hose instead of the special inflator Octo hose.

 

[redacted]

Here's what I am saying though:

The Air2 fill test he suggested as evidence of the Schraeder in the hose being the restriction is (probably) a test of a Non Schraeder inflator (the one inside the Air2) against a Schraeder inflator (the average inflator other than the Scubapro Balanced inflator, and the "K" inflator).

If you test a Scubapro Balanced inflator (which uses a standard inflator hose with a Schraeder in it) against an Air2 (which uses the non-Schrader hose) you will see that their fill rates are nearly identical. Which says that the Schraeder in the hose is not the source of slow BCD filling, rather it is the Schraeder inside the typical inflator (which is not usually fully depressed, thus not fully open in the inflator internals).

Like I said, we tropical tech guys diving in steel all around, and in wetsuits, need really, really fast inflators for our redundant bladders, so we actually played around with this stuff. We even went to far as to switch the nipple on our inflators to use Air2 hoses thinking that thet would help, but we found that the difference came from the inflator internals, and not from the hose internals.

It seems that the inflator hose Schraeder is fully depressed by a (non corroded) inflator nipple, so it ends up not being the thing restricting fill speed for the BCD. The Schraeder internal to many inflator designs, however is not fully depressed even with the full travel of the fill button on the inflator, and thus does restrict the speed of fill.

(FOr most divers, and in most circumstances, a slower filling inflator would be better for safety. For us, all we cared about was the inflator's fill speed, for safety. If the primary bladder failed when we had four steel tanks and only a .5 mil suit for buoyancy, we would sink like stones. So we actually checked all this stuff out.)

I understand and agree from a BCD inflation standpoint. The inflators that use some type of LP seat or o-ring based valve support greater flow rates into the BCD than those that use the more restrictive and fragile schradder valve.

 

[BoltSnap]

This is the longest discussion I have seen on "nipples."