Dive Planning

[rockjock3]

4 laps has to be 200 yards by standard, or a little short of an 1/8 mile, while it is not timed, it is a requirement to get certified

Yea, that is what I said.

 

[rockjock3]

While I won't directly dispute rockjock3's statement regarding PADI's swimming requirement, I will say that I've never seen it. I may bounce between agencies, but I have interfaced and assisted with multiple PADI shops without every observing a 'swim test'.

Then stop bouncing and actually watch the whole class. Or, there is this new thing called "GOOGLE". I did Padi OW 4 years ago and had to do a swim test, I did DM 2 years ago and had to do a 800y swim test, I did a google search and found swim test requirements for every agency I did a search for on.

 

[Steve50]

In a PADI OW course, the instructor needs to sign off that a swim test was conducted....

 

[parkerco]

A couple questions to toss out to the general public ...

In what class were you taught the "how to" of dive planning?

What did it involve, and how does that apply to the diving you do today?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

In terms of the OP's point about dive planning (and lack of initiative to do so), I think Bob hit on the key component of this (and btw Bob thank you for the articles on your website, studied those when I was first getting into this sport this year and learned a ton about what I don't know, which is the most valuable education I think you can get!).

I've been pondering dive planning lately as someone who's just finished PADI OW, done a few dives in the Caribbean (DM led) and have now signed up for AOW. As such, and having now read quite a bit of the AOW book, I've realized while planning out some dives at our local mud-hole how much OW leaves out that I think is fairly important to developing a dive plan that you'd feel confident in and that OW really doesn't focus on much (mine didn't, anyhow).

In OW at my LDS we learned how to use the RDP, the basic adjustments for altitude (Denver isn't called the Mile High City for nothing), how to navigate in a straight line and back, and to check our gauges, etc. And perhaps that's fine for starters ... I can go out to a site, bust out the RDP, and as long as I know the site well enough to know the depth and basic landmarks I can plot out a basic out-and-back plan for a daytime dive. I've got the basic skills to check my gear, make sure it's working, etc., dive with a buddy, to dive into the current going out where applicable, etc.

Having read through the AOW book like I said, however, I've picked up quite a bit more info that's important and answers the questions and insecurities I had planning dives right out of OW. Navigation for, example ... measuring distance, using the compass to do more than 2-direction navigating, etc. How to deal with becomming disoriented, and simple survival skills like clues to look for to re-orient (surge, current, signs on the bottom, etc.). How to plan a multi-level dive. How to calculate SAC/RMV and adopt those into a dive plan. Little things like that add up, though.

I think that may be part of the OP's answer and the question Bob asked ... the basic training (at least that PADI does, I certainly can't speak for other organizations) doesn't really focus on anything but the most basic parts of dive planning, and in fact due to how information is "leaked" via further training OW really qualifies you mostly to just get further training. I mean given that the last chapter of the OW book is pretty much "sign up immediately for more training!" that shouldn't be a big shock. But it's not exactly the recipe for creating self-motivated explorers straight out of OW either ... and I think that's furthered by the fact that, at least in my limited experience, a lot of dive trips seem to be more guided tours than opportunities to get out there and create your own experience.

I've wondered throughout this process, and more so now in learning more detailed information about the sport through AOW and online (like here!) what percentage of divers continue their formal diving education after OW. Because if the majority just does OW you may have part of your answer as to why more people don't plan their own dives.

On the flip-side, OW gives someone new to the sport a LOT of information, all of which seems pretty important. So while I can see the benefit of the training a document like Bob's gas management article on his website provides, I wonder if that's too much to add in to the same training sessions where you are learning something as basic as how to clear a mask and which button adds air to the BCD? There's a lot of talk about minimizing task-loading on these boards for safety reasons -- I have a feeling that's the reason OW only teaches so much as well, and I think dive planning falls into that category of information that is brushed over to focus on more basic information.

 

[kanonfodr]

With respect to learning how to execute independent dives, it takes some willingness to get spanked, I think...And it requires a bit of courage

Once again, the wise TSandM hits the nail right on the head. I remember doing my first dive after OW, it involved the guy who got me hooked on scuba diving and no adult leadership. I believe the plan was to swim outside the cove, descend and drop flag, and we would surface at 500 PSI. It was an absolute blast and we can't wait to dive that site again.

On the opposite side of the coin, we hit another dive site that has a loyal following, but we came away with a bad taste in our mouths from not only the salt water but also the fact that we completely botched the navigation. We were both renting gear at that time and it was an expensive/long failure in our opinion (we spent about 3 hours in the water, most of that surface swimming. Needless to say, no repetitive dives that day.)

But I'm not here to toot my horn as being one of the more lusty and exploratory individuals in the world, I'm just trying to back up what has been stated above with my own thoughts on it. And yeah, most people would rather bank on a sure thing rather than go out on a limb. But I've found that going out on that limb often has incredible rewards waiting on the tip.

BTW, I love the idea about using nautical charts to hunt down dive sites. I am no longer going to be bored at work today .

Peace,
Greg

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

On the flip-side, OW gives someone new to the sport a LOT of information, all of which seems pretty important. So while I can see the benefit of the training a document like Bob's gas management article on his website provides, I wonder if that's too much to add in to the same training sessions where you are learning something as basic as how to clear a mask and which button adds air to the BCD? There's a lot of talk about minimizing task-loading on these boards for safety reasons -- I have a feeling that's the reason OW only teaches so much as well, and I think dive planning falls into that category of information that is brushed over to focus on more basic information.

Thanks for the comments. To clarify the one I've highlighted ... I initially wrote the text for that article as part of my AOW curriculum. I agree with you that to present it in depth as part of OW is too much for the "standard" OW class (as opposed to a multi-week class such as are taught in universities). On the other hand, diving is very much about your mental approach ... and as someone pointed out in a previous reply, teaching new diving students that something besides their NDL's may be (and usually will be) the limiting factor in their dive is important. I do use the car analogy in OW, and introduce the concepts there without going into the math. The point isn't to teach them gas management, per se ... but to get them thinking about the concepts.

On the other hand, I've had plenty of newly certed OW divers read through the article and ask some very insightful questions ... even had one create a nifty Excel spreadsheet for calculating rock bottoms.

Never underestimate what a new dive student can learn if they are given enough information to ask the right questions.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

A couple questions to toss out to the general public ...

In what class were you taught the "how to" of dive planning?

What did it involve, and how does that apply to the diving you do today?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I think the bulk of "how to" dive planning came from mentors after I was certified (PADI 1976). But we did get some of that in class. More than today? I don't think so, but the class was longer so I think that helped in other ways (more confidence I think).

I'm lucky (much like the Puget Sound divers) in that I have decent diving just minutes from where I live and work. And driving for an hour or two gets me to "world class" diving.

As far as dive planning... well, most of the dives I do are incredibly simple and easy compared to diving in the Pacific Northwest.... but of all my dives, I've only been on seven (after OW in 1976) that were lead by a professional.

As far as what gcbryan referred to as "initiative/leadership/judgment/responsibility": I began solo diving about 8-10 dives after OW, and plan and lead the majority of "buddy" dives I do (with my family these days).

Best wishes.

 

[TMHeimer]

I always have some sort of plan with basic navigation. I'll go solo but not below 30 feet, and really watch for entanglement, currents, etc. It's a little more difficult if diving with a buddy who you just met.

 

[gcbryan]

Good responses all. I particularly identify with kanonfodr's post.

If you put yourself out there a little more (in a safe way) you learn a lot more. If you miscalculate a little with current and have a little tougher time on the return swim you learn a lot about current.

If you are out on a windy day and suddenly have larger breaking waves on a long surface swim you learn how to deal with that.

If you plan out drift dives that require some timing and gas planning you've learned other skills.

If you pick these learning experiences (using your head of course rather than just jumping in at a dangerous site) then one day when you unexpectedly find yourself in very challenging conditions you have the tools to get out of it without panic.

Many of the diver deaths we see around here would appear to be prevented (easily) if some of the things I'm talking about experience-wise had applied.

Most things in diving are really pretty simple. You just have to experience them a few times. Night diving is no big deal, neither is current (within reason), nor waves or most other things that one could face in diving.

It's just that if they all come upon you for the first time in the wrong location and when you haven't gotten any experience with them individually in a more benign location you very well may get bitten.

I like the advice I got from a rock climbing buddy once who said that you can climb the kind of routes that you are good at but you won't really get that much better overall as a climber.

You learn much more trying to climb the kind of routes that you aren't good at. Improving just a little regarding your weaknesses will make you a much better climber overall than continuing to be great at the things that you are already good at.

I would disagree that if you want to gain experience in current that you should bring a scooter along. I would look at that as a crutch.

If you have experience in current and plan a big dive in an area with current then sure if you have a scooter bring it but if you aren't comfortable with current or good with planning for slack then I don't think a scooter is the way to go. Just my opinion obviously.

If you are married to a dive buddy and have a boat you don't need an exploration group either...except for the T-shirts perhaps! (note to self...quit picking on Lynne).

 

[fisheater]

Wow.

I guess I was lucky. I'm a relatively new diver (OW in Jan. '08) and I've taken a lot of classes (AOW, Rescue, 7 specialties) and I'm a DM candidate (which I guess used to mean something).

However, I sure learned how to plan dives. Before I finished OW, I joined the North Coast Divers in California and that's where I did my real diving. No DMs. No dive boats. No nothing, but shore and the North Pacific Ocean, which sometimes doesn't want you to dive. That meant every dive was planned, including bringing everything that you might need. At first, I relied upon the more experienced divers I met in the club. Each dive had a plan. Maybe not a formal plan, with a laundry list of contingencies, but it was a plan with directions, depths, turn pressures, goals and lost buddy procedures.

Then, I just naturally started to have enough experience to have a say in those plans. Then, I sometimes find myself being the more experienced one and making the plans (of course, based upon that experience and prior plans).

I just figured that that was how it was supposed to work.

Reading stuff on SB and seeing how vacation divers approach diving, I realize that my experience is far from universal. That's too bad.

In a world where the vast majority flock to amusement parks for corporate packaged "thrills," I shouldn't expect much.