Diver lost in Cozumel today

[citycountryguy]

I don't think anybody actually knows for certain what the husband actually really did. If there is a first hand account from him that I missed please direct me to it. However, nobody really knows exactly how much time passed from when he first realized he wanted to signal the dive master to how long it took to actually do it and then go back after his wife. It could have been almost instantaneous or it could have been a couple of minutes. Whatever the time it was that passed it was too long. I doubt it was instantaneous and I doubt it was as quick as everyone seems to want to believe. It just doesn't add up. With visibility of 60-120 feet in Cozumel, with a diver going upward which would be a diagonal assent if there was strong current, it would take more than just a few seconds for her to disappear under good visibility.

Agreed. But I've spent a lot of time thinking about this, and here is what I think could have happened that would fit all of the reports. If she signaled her husband to ascend, and then began making movements to do that, and he turned to try to notify the DM (as he may have been instructed to do in the pre-dive briefing), it may have been a few seconds. Maybe 10, maybe a touch longer. But, it didn't need to be longer than that if he was far enough away from her such that she got caught in a downwelling but he did not. (On a thread here or elsewhere about this incident one diver who was also on the reef that day reported that they were caught in a downwelling that was quite strong, while the DM who was close by (within 10-20 feet, as I recall) was perfectly fine hovering with no downwelling.)

What I've thought about in that scenario is where I would look--and the answer would be--above me. Especially in a lateral current like Coz has naturally. I'd look straight above, I'd look above and in the direction of the current I was in. My natural tendency would be to look above me, and I don't know how long I'd be looking toward the surface, or at least laterally at the depth she was when she signaled, before it would dawn on me to look down and away from the reef into the blue--which is where she may have been if caught in a downwelling. And if the downwelling was fast, how many seconds would it be before the decreasing light, and movement in a counter-intuitive direction, before I would no longer be able to see my buddy whenever I started looking in the opposite direction of where someone indicated they were going.

That, to me, is the real possible tragedy and one real lesson for me in this. The husband may actually not have been that far away from his wife for some critical period of time. He just may not have "been able to see" her because he wasn't looking the right way. And my takeaway is that when you are in currents, don't assume the prevailing one is the only one. If you at first don't see your buddy in the direction you thought they were headed, to a quick 360 scan to see if your normal instincts based on the conditions/currents you feel are not accurately reflecting the conditions your buddy may have experienced. Look quickly everywhere. And if they signaled ascent, and they aren't in the direction you thought they were headed, scope out the "opposite" way. Because you have instantly entered a significant rescue situation. Something has gone terribly wrong, and looking where someone obviously isn't will not be helpful.

 

[Laurie S.]

This is from the Sand Dollar website:


Then on the home page where it says cruise ship guests click here.......


A dive shop that actually refuses to take divers unless they book through the cruise ship. Talk about being in bed with the cruise corporations........
Once again another story of how money won over safety.
What was that about how you are the safest?

Their contract with the cruiseline prohibits them taking divers independently off the ship. I've always wondered why a diver would want to use the ship's contractor independently, seems like a stupid move to me.

 

[ScubaJoeH]

The cruise ships specifically make no recommendation about any dive operators, or even acknowledge their existence, ever. I know because I've been asking them for years. They're most likely concerned about getting sued.

My operator in Coz worked very briefly with cruise companies. She said the margin is very thin for her-- she runs the 6-pack boats not the cattle boats-- and that the level of divers was too green for her comfort. At least one of the cruise operators sends people the way of the approved vendors and then marks up the excursion to make up for the free buffets.

 

[Mike]

Once again another story of how money won over safety.

How do you figure that?

Once again another story of how money won over safety.
What was that about how you are the safest?

I'd also be cautious in the accusations you're making with no proof other than what you've read on the internet and are drawing your own conclusions and slandering that company. You aren't invisible and they can come after you. You have zero proof, zero knowledge of anything that transpired, but are making some very serious accusations.

 

[DandyDon]

Their contract with the cruiseline prohibits them taking divers independently off the ship. I've always wondered why a diver would want to use the ship's contractor independently, seems like a stupid move to me.

To be on the same dive boat as the other cruise boat divers but play half as much? I've heard that cruise boats will lie about how dangerous Cozumel is to visitors who don't stick to their approved tour operators, retail stores, bars & cafes, etc. as the cruise lines get commissions from all of those.

 

[ScubaJoeH]

well reading all this threads it definitely changed my mind about going to Cozumel

my question is what about Mayan Riviera and Playa del Carmen, are they better for new divers?

I think Coz can be a wonderful place for new divers. This works well if you have an accomodating operator who lets you shore dive for free and has afternoon trips so you can stay in close at first and venture out as you lay the foundation you need for the more advanced dives. Even better if you can be a group of 4 or 5 so you can pick the sites you are comfortable on. Go in the summer/fall for low current and warm water-- and cheaper trips.

Coz was my wife and my first dive trip. We dove with Scuba Shack/Blue Bubble/Roberta's Dive Eco Cozumel. They run small boats, 6-8 on a trip. We had a DM and an instructor and 3 other divers. I was concerned we were getting in over our heads, but all went well all week and the DM and the instructor AND the other divers helped us advance our knowledge so much more quickly than diving lakes, etc. The slow drifts, the open-water safety stops in the current (no line to hang on) and the boat rolls and in-water doffing of gear advanced our skills very quickly. We learned when you get ahead of the group, you duck in behind the coral or get close to the bottom and wait for them to catch you-- you cannot fin back up current. If you're behind the group, use the current to catch up. Common sense when you think about it. But not common to a new diver. We've had very manageable current on all our trips to COZ...

Until last week. Yeah, it was nuts. We were on Palancar Caves the morning of the accident. I experienced what I've referred to as "the washing machine" in one of the canyons/sand chutes. The current was going multiple directions within just a few feet. And you could see it from the debris in the water. The other divers on top did not experience it. My wife was on the channel side and did not experience it but could see me experiencing it. Really strange. We were also part of the search on the way back in from that dive.

We had some very strong current on Dalila a couple of days before as well. I would NOT have wanted to do that my first time out. We also did a night dive that started out pretty slow but soon seemed like a 10mph rip over Bolones. I did not like that but there was no way i was going to abort at night and end up a mile from the rest of the group in the dark even if I had a signal strobe.

 

[Ayisha]

To be on the same dive boat as the other cruise boat divers but play half as much? I've heard that cruise boats will lie about how dangerous Cozumel is to visitors who don't stick to their approved tour operators, retail stores, bars & cafes, etc. as the cruise lines get commissions from all of those.

That statement about the dangers of non-ship approved tour ops and vendors is made at the welcome briefing with emergency procedures all over, including Coz. It's made again at least once if not at the arrival in every port. I've been on several cruise lines and they've all been the same. During tours, they will tell you which shops, bars and restaurants are the "safest" and most "authentic" to visit as well...

---------- Post added April 3rd, 2012 at 11:55 PM ----------

But, it didn't need to be longer than that if he was far enough away from her such that she got caught in a downwelling but he did not. (On a thread here or elsewhere about this incident one diver who was also on the reef that day reported that they were caught in a downwelling that was quite strong, while the DM who was close by (within 10-20 feet, as I recall) was perfectly fine hovering with no downwelling.)

I made a post on this site at some point about a Coz LDS trip I was on in 2004. A certified couple from our group was swept down from 90 feet to 130 feet without apparent warning and within seconds. They saw the instructor near them swim madly away from the wall and got out from the downcurrent and he saw them drop. The current let go of the couple at 130 feet and they made their way up slowly. It was near the beginning of the dive and they had plenty of air to do so. No one else was affected around them.

They were on a different boat than me, so I did not witness it, but heard from each participant. The instructor thought they both lost control of their buoyancy and said downcurrents didn't exist, and then I came here and verified that it was a true phenomenon.

 

[Laurie S.]

To be on the same dive boat as the other cruise boat divers but play half as much? I've heard that cruise boats will lie about how dangerous Cozumel is to visitors who don't stick to their approved tour operators, retail stores, bars & cafes, etc. as the cruise lines get commissions from all of those.

I have been on eight cruises since 2009. The price of the ship's dive excursion versus private is typically 10 to 20 percent higher, not twice as much. The difference really is neglible and transportation always is included. I use private excursions because I don't want a cattle boat and restrictive diving, not necessarily because it's cheaper. In fact, the Grand Turk excursion we just used was $19 less per two-tank dive than the private operator.

 

[AggieDiver]

I don't think anybody actually knows for certain what the husband actually really did. If there is a first hand account from him that I missed please direct me to it. However, nobody really knows exactly how much time passed from when he first realized he wanted to signal the dive master to how long it took to actually do it and then go back after his wife. It could have been almost instantaneous or it could have been a couple of minutes. Whatever the time it was that passed it was too long. I doubt it was instantaneous and I doubt it was as quick as everyone seems to want to believe. It just doesn't add up. With visibility of 60-120 feet in Cozumel, with a diver going upward which would be a diagonal assent if there was strong current, it would take more than just a few seconds for her to disappear under good visibility.

I agree that nobody knows. I was just trying to avoid upsetting the family by talking about trying to stick closer to my buddy. I don't know what happened, so I am not in any position to assign any blame. However, prior to reading about and discussing this incident here, I can picture myself leaving my buddy to try to get the DM's attention to let them know we were aborting dive. Now, having read this thread and thought about it, I will stick with my buddy no matter what, even if it meant I didn't get to notify the DM. Just as the DM's first responsibility is to the group, my first responsibility is to my buddy. If I have to choose between my buddy and the DM, I will choose my buddy.

 

[flots am]

I have avoided getting into the whole issue of whether the DM is hired as a a guide or a protector (or whatever). But in my opinion, if you feel you need a DM with you to keep you from getting lost or killed, then maybe you should not be on that dive in the first place.

I don't think anybody should be on a non-training dive anywhere if they can't do it safely without a DM. It's fine if you want to bring someone along to show you where the eel is hiding, but each diver needs to be able to, at the very least, end the dive safely without assistance.

The point, however is that the Cozumel dive industry misleads dive tourists. The marine park requires a "dive master", which implies that the diver is diving with a professional entrusted to keep them safe on the dive. They are not told that the dive master is there to protect the reef, not the tourists, and even if he was there to protect the tourists, he may not be able to do so. In fact, in my experience, may not have the judgement necessary to do so.

Some ops, like Aldora, have a policy that everyone ascends together. Fine, that is their policy and it may well be safer and I have no complaints or criticisms of that procedure. I suppose if a diver feels that they are only safe in a group and when accompanied by a DM, then they should ask about such policies before booking dives.

A large portion of dive fatalities occur when the diver safely reaches the surface, but then fails to stay there, drops back below the surface and is lost, injured or dies. This can be caused by any number of SCUBA or medical-related problems and is why it's so important to ascend with a buddy.

There is relative safety with a well-trained buddy. There is only perceived safety in a group, with or without a DM.

flots.