Diving only in what you trained in ignorance

[dmaziuk]

You probably got taught to use a compass also. But you in no way was taught everything you had to know for navigation. Anything you got taught in OW or AOW was just the highlights of more comprehensive courses. The same thing can be said for buoyancy, rescue, equipment specialist.

As Texanguy said, there's different people. I think the "dive only in the same pool you did your OW in" comes from the assumption that the diver's an idiot incapable of getting out of bed without breaking their neck, and then when they do, their next of kin will sue the shop out of business. The flip side is those who assume the diver is capable of kicking against a mild current and will not have a panic attack if they see 80' on their depth gauge. So they get called "lunatic dive masters". Personally I prefer the lunatic ones: I'd rather thumb a dive because it feels too stressful than because it feels like a straightjacket.

 

[The Kraken]

For all intents and purposes, the physics in the pool are the same as those in the open sea.

While there are other considerations in ocean diving that one doesn't need be concerned with in other venues, tides, current, etc., the diving aspect is the same.

Plan, prepare, go dive . . .

Safe dives . . . . . .
. . . safer ascents !

the K

 

[Sonnylynnvick75]

Really? This seems so unlikely. How do you even know you covered ALL aspects? Or is this just hyperbole?

Let me rephase this, we covered the basics of boat diving in OW class. we were taught entry and exit in pool simulation, we were taught what to ask the captain and what to do when diving from a boat. I apologize, I didn't realize diving from a boat required so much training and knowledge.

 

[tursiops]

Let me rephase this, we covered the basics of boat diving in OW class. we were taught entry and exit in pool simulation, we were taught what to ask the captain and what to do when diving from a boat. I apologize, I didn't realize diving from a boat required so much training and knowledge.

Maybe after you've done a few boat dives on varying boats in varying conditions with varying on-board rules, you'll see that what you learned in your OW class is barely enough to get you started. I see a lot of newbies come on a boat without a clue about etiquette, how to store their gear, what to bring, entries other than giant strides and exits other than climbing up a ladder, how to use a swinging ladder, which is port and which is starboard, staying away from the propeller, avoiding sea sickness, etc.

As in many endeavors, it is what you don't know that can hurt you.

 

[Sonnylynnvick75]

Maybe after you've done a few boat dives on varying boats in varying conditions with varying on-board rules, you'll see that what you learned in your OW class is barely enough to get you started. I see a lot of newbies come on a boat without a clue about etiquette, how to store their gear, what to bring, entries other than giant strides and exits other than climbing up a ladder, how to use a swinging ladder, which is port and which is starboard, staying away from the propeller, avoiding sea sickness, etc.

As in many endeavors, it is what you don't know that can hurt you.

I have done a few boat dives in what were admittedly similar conditions and I feel like my OW class covered the majority of what I needed to know when boat diving. I have used a standard ladder, Climbing on to a platform with no ladder, Taking my BC off at the surface climbing in the boat and then pulling my gear in. I learned to only carry what you absolutely need for the activity you will be doing. I learned proper boat ettiquette, etc.

I don't say this to sound bigger than myself, I, In fact am quite humble a diver. I say this and make all these points because not all OW classes are the same. I was blessed with an incredible LDS who took time to cover much of what was not required in order to make us better divers.

 

[Basking Ridge Diver]

For all intents and purposes, the physics in the pool are the same as those in the open sea.
the K

But is it the physics that is is the hardest to master? Is the diving aspect really the same?

I believe it is the mind game that can be the most difficult - being in the OW has a lot more to fear than a pool. If a new diver gets nervous they can go to the side of the pool or ladder and get out - that is very comforting to most new divers.

Put the new diver in the OW with currents, tides, in a boat and a little thing like doubt or fear can creep in and wreck havoc on their mind and change the dive completely... It is the fear of the unknown or doubt that they really have the skills to be there - until they do a dive like that and hopefully with someone that has experience it can be a bit traumatic. I am not saying everyone goes through this but certainly I have seen doubt and a bit of fear ruin a dive. Once you talk the person through the issues or what to expect I have seem most calm down and then able to enjoy the experience.

So to me it is the mental game that is the most difficult to master - then the question becomes is it experience or hubris that allows you to enter new conditions and not get that feeling again...

 

[Bob DBF]

Training by catch phrases, SCUBA is not the only offender. It gives the student an answer on the test but no knowledge to make the phrase useful, and the instructor does not actually be all that good to get the student past the test. I didn't hear "qualifies you to dive in conditions similar to those in which you were trained", "depth limit of 60' for OW", "it's life support", and so on until I started reading ScubaBoard. Granted that my experience with initial SCUBA training and OW was long ago, but now there are still instructors that will take the time to discuss, in great detail, the limitations of your training and how to go about expanding your limits without major problems and without major catch phrases.

No, RJP, OW divers are not dying in droves, however the SCUBA industry is on the decline and the quality of initial diver training might have something to do with new divers finding a different hobby.



Bob
--------------------------------------------

That's my point, people, by and large, are not taught that diving can be deadly, they are taught how safe it is, and they are not equipped with the skills, taught and trained to the level required to be useful in an emergency.

 

[AfterDark]

Then there's the anybody can dive mindset. Sure anybody can dive; with a bunch of rules, restrictions, conditions and certifications and a DM thrown in there just in case. The more I read SB the happier I am I started diving when I did. This nanny stuff would have turned me off from the start.


I was diving with someone a few years ago that signaled me to surface halfway thru the dive. We had been at 60fsw for a while so a SS was in order. We surfaced quite a ways from shore with a good half hour surface swim ahead and less than 1000psi. When I asked him why he needed to surface so far out he told me his PDC was telling him he had 3 min before going into deco. I had explained the plan to him which included a change to shallow depths on the way back to extended our gas usage and as a long SS. We needed to go up to 20fsw for the trip back. The point is this guy couldn't get past his PDC telling him he had 3 min NDL left. His training and experience apparently didn't prepare him for anything beyond, go down, stay down, computer says go up, go up.

 

[boulderjohn]

No, RJP, OW divers are not dying in droves, however the SCUBA industry is on the decline and the quality of initial diver training might have something to do with new divers finding a different hobby.

According to the History of NAUI I have cited about 4 times in different threads in the past few days, the Advanced Open Water course was created first by Los Angeles County, with NAUI following soon after, in an attempt to solve the problem of the high dropout rate in scuba. Divers were getting certified and then dropping out of diving altogether. That was 50 years ago.

According to PADI statistics, the number of new certifications they have issued world-wide has remained roughly steady at about the 900,000 per year over the last 16 years. There was a small dip after the 2008 recession, but the numbers have returned to the pre-2008 level. To my knowledge, other agencies have not released their numbers.

In sharp contrast, the numbers of active golfers and tennis players has dropped dramatically over that same time period. The golf industry in America considers it a crisis, with record numbers of courses closing each year.

Take the phrase "Decline in golf popularity" and Google it. Then Google again and again and again, each time changing the name of the sport. You may be surprised to learn that in comparison with almost all other active sports, scuba is actually dong pretty well.

 

[phoenix31tt]

The point is this guy couldn't get past his PDC telling him he had 3 min NDL left. His training and experience apparently didn't prepare him for anything beyond, go down, stay down, computer says go up, go up.

The funny thing is that most computers wouldn't send you straight up if you're nearing deco limits... They send you shallower... But as you say... Computer says up that means up all the way...



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