drysuit as BC

[MXGratefulDiver]

Rick - you assume one needs loft of your insulation in order to maintain warmth. That may be true for something like a weezle, but many varieties of DS insulation (Diving Concepts, Bare, the DUI stuff) can be crushed to all heck and lose only minimal insulating value.

Doesn't work for me. I use a Diving Concepts undergarment, and if I don't keep some air in my suit for loft I get cold ... and I'm built like a harbor seal ...

That said ... I have "discovered" the advantages of minimal air in the drysuit, and relying primarily on the wing for buoyancy. It's a more stable platform for maneuvering ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Diver0001]

Rick - you assume one needs loft of your insulation in order to maintain warmth. That may be true for something like a weezle, but many varieties of DS insulation (Diving Concepts, Bare, the DUI stuff) can be crushed to all heck and lose only minimal insulating value.

True to a point...... In BC the water was always 8C give or take and it didn't matter at all in those temps. I now live in Holland and I make at least a dozen dives a year with a water temp of 0C to +2C and believe me when it's that cold you want as much space (air) between you and that water as you can manage. I've even had a dive in water at -2C. That's one for my personal record books. Froze my patush off and after only 45 I gave up ..... Took about 1/2 hour before I could talk again without sounding like I had just been to the dentist.... LOL

I had another general comment while I'm at it. Boogie is right about the motivation for using only the drysuit for buoyancy control. It is an attempt to reduce task loading. However, although PADI's materials (knowledge review and video) mention using only the DS for buoyancy control the standards do not mandate this approach. I'm hoping to clarify that. It's not a PADI standard and there are a great many DS instructors out there who don't teach it that way.

R..

 

[geraldp]

Thanks for the replies. I'll check out the Dynamic Instability article. My drysuit class was taught to a group of OW students, so I suspect you're right the instructor was trying to simplify the number of controls for us students. I'm now at 25 dives (17 of them dry), and I'm finding I still have trim problems at depth. Adding ankle weights to my shell suit helped, but as you guys have pointed out that wasn't my problem. Next dive I'll start using my BC instead (after getting rid of the squeeze).

Jerry

 

[debdiver]

Just get your trim right. That should solve it.

IMHO... folks that use their BC underwater just never figured out their trim and use the BC as a crutch. If it works, go for it. But if you are weighted properly and you have good boyancy control, you will not need much air in your drysuit to stay neutral.

Don't forget, back to basics here, but your boyancy is controlled by ALL your airspaces. Even if you just "use" your BC underwater, there is some air in your drysuit. In another thread some one joked that the air in your drysuit doesn't know how NOT to be part of your boyancy.

 

[Boogie711]

Just get your trim right. That should solve it.

IMHO... folks that use their BC underwater just never figured out their trim and use the BC as a crutch. If it works, go for it. But if you are weighted properly and you have good boyancy control, you will not need much air in your drysuit to stay neutral.

Don't forget, back to basics here, but your boyancy is controlled by ALL your airspaces. Even if you just "use" your BC underwater, there is some air in your drysuit. In another thread some one joked that the air in your drysuit doesn't know how NOT to be part of your boyancy.

Oh, give me a break!

The same poster who admitted she uses her drysuit for bouyancy simply because "it was easier" and that using her BC "was for techie type divers" is now claiming that using your BC in the water is "a crutch??????"

Now, that is TOOOO funny.

And by the way folks - may I remind you this is the DIR forum. The poster asked for the DIR methodology. Not a misguided justification of poor habits, Deb.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Just get your trim right. That should solve it.

IMHO... folks that use their BC underwater just never figured out their trim and use the BC as a crutch. If it works, go for it. But if you are weighted properly and you have good boyancy control, you will not need much air in your drysuit to stay neutral.

Don't forget, back to basics here, but your boyancy is controlled by ALL your airspaces. Even if you just "use" your BC underwater, there is some air in your drysuit. In another thread some one joked that the air in your drysuit doesn't know how NOT to be part of your boyancy.

Um ... no. The point is to use as little gas in your drysuit as you need for warmth.

I learned to use my drysuit for buoyancy, and did it that way for several hundred dives. I think I can comfortably say I was pretty darn good at it.

However ... when I started using my wing for buoyancy, I came to realize that using my drysuit had some inherent limitations.

When you want to invert to peer under a ledge, all the air in your drysuit migrates to your boots.

When you want to barrel roll, the air in your drysuit is going to vent out your dump valve as your left side rotates upward.

When you want to flip over on your back and peer at something above you, the air migrates to your chest and legs, making proper trim more difficult.

None of those things happen when you're using your BCD for trim ... or more accurate I guess would be to say the air migration is less, making proper trim more efficient.

Diving is about more than just getting horizontal and staying there. It's a 3-D experience. Although I was able do all the things I mentioned above while using my drysuit for buoyancy, I have to say it's far easier and more stable with less air in the drysuit, and a little air in the wing.

It's not about "using a crutch" ... it's about using the best tool for the job.

And Boogie's right ... this is the DIR forum. We should not be promoting non-DIR methods here.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Atticus]

Just get your trim right. That should solve it.

IMHO... folks that use their BC underwater just never figured out their trim and use the BC as a crutch. If it works, go for it. But if you are weighted properly and you have good boyancy control, you will not need much air in your drysuit to stay neutral. <snip>

I have to disagree with you as well deb. I started out using the drysuit for buoyancy as well and am reasonably good at it. When I started diving with doubles I found that it took too much inflation in the suit to compensate for the weight change as I breathed the doubles down (weighted for neutral buoyancy with empty tanks you start out about 10 lbs negative, depending on gear setup).

I then started diving exclusively with the BC for buoyancy whether I was in a single or doubles and my diving experience improved...

I think it's unfortunate that some training agencies insist on pushing the drysuit buoyancy thing in their classes.

BTW: DUI in their owners manual recommends NOT using the drysuit for buoyancy if you are diving doubles as it is hard on the suit.