Finning Muscles

[LI Diver]

Does anyone know exactly which muscles are the primary ones used in the common scuba kick (flutter kick?) ? I mean I know the quads are used to extend the lower legs and the femoral biceps (or hams) are used to bend the lower legs but how about the glutes and the abs for moving the upper legs? Which do the brunt of the work? Is there equal force on both the up and down stroke of the fin? And how about finning technique should I be bending my knees or kicking stiff legged?:06:

 

[DiverBuoy]

Depends on how bad you are at the flutter kick. It should start from the hips and roll for the most power, with least exertion. If you asked some people they would say "you mean it isn't all in the ankles?"

 

[DiverBuoy]

On the other hand check out the video's on www.gue.com ... when I took the DIR-F course, we were really working the calves and ankles to prevent our knees from dropping into the hydro-alley and interrupt our forward momentum. That certainly wasn't about rolling from the hips. It was about control, while maintaining perfect buoyancy and keeping ones fins and legs behind the tank.

 

[LI Diver]

On the other hand check out the video's on www.gue.com ... when I took the DIR-F course, we were really working the calves and ankles to prevent our knees from dropping into the hydro-alley and interrupt our forward momentum. That certainly wasn't about rolling from the hips. It was about control, while maintaining perfect buoyancy and keeping ones fins and legs behind the tank.

Thanks DB I just ordered the DIR-f manual It looks interesting next I probably will get the diving fitness book.
Ed

 

[DiverBuoy]

I like the new avatar and I'm very pleased to hear your continued interest in "further" and "proper" dive education. You will NOT regret it.

 

[LI Diver]

I like the new avatar and I'm very pleased to hear your continued interest in "further" and "proper" dive education. You will NOT regret it.

Tanks!

 

[CameronMartz]

Does anyone know exactly which muscles are the primary ones used in the common scuba kick (flutter kick?) ? I mean I know the quads are used to extend the lower legs and the femoral biceps (or hams) are used to bend the lower legs but how about the glutes and the abs for moving the upper legs? Which do the brunt of the work? Is there equal force on both the up and down stroke of the fin? And how about finning technique should I be bending my knees or kicking stiff legged?:06:

The force requirements are dependant not only on finning technique but also fin choice. Most blade fins are more flexible when bent towards the heel rather than the knee, easing pressure on the front of the knee when finning. In any case, you'll use every muscle in you legs at some point during flutter kick, plus hip flexors and extensors.

I prefer frog kick with stiff fins, like Jet Fins, over flutter kick under almost all circumstances in part because I think it takes better advantage of the muscle pump in delivering blood to the muscles in your legs. Actually, I rarely kick that hard when I dive, but even when I do, frog kick gets the job done.

Cycling with clipless pedals is probably the best thing you can do on land to develop the muscles used in finning. The movements of a proper pedal stroke are similar to finning, especially when you're using proper ankle movement when riding (something most beginning cyclists must work on). While strength training will certainly have its benefits, rarely will you have the need to apply maximum force to your fins, and you won't be able to keep it up very long.

Cameron

 

[LI Diver]

I have tried the frog kick and have had pain in the hip joints after a few kick cycles I most certainly am not doing it right. I ocassionaly get twinges in my right hip on land but very infrequent. I can work out fine without pain although when using the hip abductor machine I go light and do have a bit of sensation in that hip joint. I ordered some books and are going to try to improve my finning techniques. I can flutter kick all day with no problem I just would like to lower my air consumption. I know it will come with experience but I figured I could speed it up a little.
Is the frog kick the same as the kick we learned as a child for the elementary back stroke? Is there an added ankle movement in there? Thanks for the replies!
Ed

 

[CameronMartz]

SCUBA frog kick is much less "violent" than for breast stroke. Because you're wearing fins, you do not need as much whipping force, nor as much hip rotation, as when swimming breast stroke. Check out the two frog kick videos at http://www.divetekadventures.com/Images.htm. There are other websites with good videos, too, but these should give you an idea of how much propulsion you can get without winding up with your hips.

It could be, though, that you have a chronic hip injury that will cause you pain even when performing the appropriate technique. If this is the case, then I would certain work to identify what the problem is and rehab/recondition it so that your hip doesn't bother you on land.

Cameron

 

[LI Diver]

SCUBA frog kick is much less "violent" than for breast stroke. Because you're wearing fins, you do not need as much whipping force, nor as much hip rotation, as when swimming breast stroke. Check out the two frog kick videos at http://www.divetekadventures.com/Images.htm. There are other websites with good videos, too, but these should give you an idea of how much propulsion you can get without winding up with your hips.

It could be, though, that you have a chronic hip injury that will cause you pain even when performing the appropriate technique. If this is the case, then I would certain work to identify what the problem is and rehab/recondition it so that your hip doesn't bother you on land.

Cameron

Wow thanks again, great video's at link, I think I must have some flexibility issues from old injuries after viewing the frog kick vids. It looked so effortless.
Ed