Halcyon & Santi's policy: we perform drysuit repairs "even without prior approval"

[stuartv]

Thanks -- I did approve the boot repair after they told me that it was no longer being covered by warranty so I am still going to pay this portion even though I disagree with how the whole ordeal went down. I did learn a valuable lesson of either recording these calls or have everything in writing going forward.

I understand and that is very honorable. But, they only told you that after they had your suit hostage. Because of the way they handled that and the issue with the zipper, I don't think I would hesitate much on disputing the entire charge with the credit company on the basis that you sent the suit to them after they told you the boots were free (twice) and you only approved the charge after they had your suit hostage - because you needed to get it back.

 

[Effervescent]

Did Halcyon actually deny that they'd told you over the phone that the boots would be covered under warranty? Obviously anyone would be (rightfully) annoyed if told twice (by phone) that the boot repair would be covered, only for the suit to be sent and then find out it isn't. At that point, was this a case of "oops" on Halcyon's part (i.e. they honorably believed the repair would be warrantied, but then found out later from SANTI that it would not) or did the suit arrive and Halcyon just told you "we never said it would be warrantied"? Assuming they accepted fault for misleading you (intentionally or not), was there any offer to make it up to you (reduced cost, quick turn around, etc)?

I called twice before I sent them my suit to clarify the policy. 8 days after I sent them my suit, they called me to let me know that the boots are not covered by warranty. I'm not exactly sure why it took 8 days just to resolve this issue between Halcyon and Santi.

At that point, Halcyon asked me how I would like to proceed. Given that my suit was already there for over a week and I wanted to get my suit back for diving season, I agreed to cover the boot repair. Given the mixup, Santi agreed to cover a portion of the boot replacement. Apparently there are many known problems with these boots and I've had to slather Aquaseal near the strap area because it is easily worn. Even though I think they should just recall these boots, I'm fine with covering this cost because at least they asked me in advance unlike the unauthorized zipper repair.

 

[Vegan Shark]

Just ordered a Santi Elite...reading this certainly makes me nervous, and I'm sure hundreds of other potential customers reading feel the same way. Hopefully they save face and correct the issue.

 

[Effervescent]

Here is Mark Messesmith's reply to a Facebook post on the same topic yesterday, August 17. You will see that he is confirming Halcyon's unethical business policy:

Alice and others, Halcyon works very hard to provide the best products and customer service possible. It appears we came up short on this occassion, for this I do apologize. Providing work and services without pre-approval is quite rare but will happen once in awhile. We support many high profile divers and projects so if a technician is in the midst of a repair and under a tight deadline, they are encouraged to do what they think is best for the customer. This was the situation with your suit. On Monday one of our customer service representatives reviewed the scope of the work completed and charges with you before the invoice was finalized. You gave us your credit card and we processed the payment as discussed. It was only after the credit card company informed us you had put a hold on the total payment that we learned of your desire to not be charged for the zipper. This was a suprise to us but as I said in my email, you are welcome to delete the cost of the zipper since the work was indeed done without your prior approval. Drysuit repairs is not a profit center for us but instead part of the services necessary to sell premium Santi suits. Our goal is to provide excellent products and service. Again I am sorry we didn't achieve this objective with you on this occasion and remain available to discuss this further if you so desire. Kind regards, Mark.

Luckily, Santi is on my side and has gone against Halcyon on this matter:

Dear Alice,
We agree that effectively the whole situation and undertaken actions were not professional. Apologies for that. Being thankful and appreciating all remarks given by our friends - divers, we always take lessons from them. SANTI is constantly working on service improvement and will do the best to avoid such a situation in the incoming future. Hoping that you will keep diving safely and dry in SANTI drysuit we wish you a great day.

 

[Effervescent]

Here is my reply to Mark:

Mark Messersmith - “Providing work and services without pre-approval” is just simply wrong and unethical. While you state that is rare, I have now received numerous private messages from fellow divers telling me that they have experienced the same sort of service from Halcyon and Extreme Exposure. This is clearly not an isolated incident despite what you believe.

This is a bad business policy that needs to be changed as you can see from the many responses from divers across Facebook, ScubaBoard and other forums. The bottom line here is that the decision to make a significant and unexpected repair, especially one that costs hundreds of dollars, should always fall on the customer.

Furthermore, I was notified about the new zipper after it was already on my suit. My suit was basically taken hostage and I had no recourse but to pay the amount including the unauthorized charge in order to get my suit back. I asked for the invoice so I could dispute the unauthorized charge. I never said that the dispute was resolved.

The fact that you are doubling down in your position is quite shocking. As the COO of Halcyon, I would have hoped that you would change your views on this unethical business policy. Basically saying that ‘I’m sorry that you feel that way’ is not an apology. This is a passive aggressive tactic that is unacceptable when dealing with customers.

 

[ReefGuy]

Ty for the warning. I'm getting ready to get some drysuits for my team.

 

[LiteHedded]

well the picture certainly looks like a santi suit. has their trademark trashbag fit

 

[seeker242]

Completely unacceptable business practice, charging for unauthorized repairs....At least they aren't trying to force you to still pay for it.

 

[lv2dive]

I am guessing my eLite is from around the same time as the OP (before any special "ladies first" suits, also from when Santi just started to get a lot of foothold in the US.) Initially, most of the custom women's suits were cut way too large on the top (especially around the shoulders) so this story sounds familiar.

I, too, had issues with my boots. One dive I ended up with a partially flooded leg and it was clear it was coming through the boot somewhere. Now, someone mentioned wear&tear but I don't think a boot suddenly failing is wear and tear.

At any rate I did not get new boots - they were just aqua sealed. I did get charged for the repair until I pointed out my issue had to have been related to the original quality of the boots vs something I did, and my drysuit was turned inside out and the issues were confirmed to be on the seams.

In general, I take my drysuit to Steve Gamble, and the only reason I didn't in this case was that I was pretty sure it was warranty work.

Sorry for the edit but I accidentally posted (nonsense) before I finished my post.

 

[Effervescent]

Mark Messersmith (COO of Halcyon) says that "We support many high profile divers and project so if a technician is in the midst of repair and under a tight deadline, they are encouraged to do what they think is best for the customer."

1) My suit was not under a tight deadline. My suit took over 6 weeks to repair. If Halcyon is incapable of processing repairs for Santi suits in a timely manner, they should admit that this is a problem and hire more technicians. Otherwise, Santi should not allow Halcyon to continue to be the official service center for the US.

2) I am not a "high profile diver". I am a regular customer who paid over $3,000 for a Santi suit. "High profile" divers have the luxury of getting key man discounts and/or free drysuits. I do not get this benefit being a regular diver. If Halcyon and Santi want to be taken seriously as a business that sells drysuits to customers instead of a start-up that makes suits for their friends, I believe that they should grow up and adopt ethical business policies.

3) The fact that drysuit repairs is not a profit center is none of my concern. I paid for a drysuit and one of the reason I chose the brand is because of quality and service. Without the service component, Santi and Halcyon would have no business.

I suggest that Santi reevaluates its relationship with Halcyon and Halcyon should reflect on its unethical business policies.

I am posting this here because Santi has took down my comments on Facebook. Divers should have the right to know that this is how they are treating problems.