Innovation In Recreational Scuba Diving?

[rx7diver]

Photography isn't really a diving innovation because none of the innovations were originally intended for scuba diving, they were intended for extreme sports in the GoPro realm, and general photography in the SLR/Video realm. Not a whole lot you can do for housings, can only get so small realistically, and that's just evolution.

I think it could be argued that the Calypso (and the Nikonos 1) with its waterproof, water-contact lenses is a very real diving innovation.

Also, I think the BC fundamentally changed how one approaches scuba diving and, hence, should be regarded as a real innovation.

EDIT: The dive watch, too, fundamentally changed how scuba dives are conducted. It should be regarded as a true innovation.

Safe Diving,

rx7diver

 

[RJP]

Diving is like like bicycles. First there was just a seat, wheels, handle bars, and one speed. Through the years in has evolved to what we have now with multiple gears, lights, computers, high tech materials, but it's still just a frame with seat and wheels that you peddle.

I'll disagree. You're not looking at what true innovation is about. Innovation isn't about what something IS. Innovation is about what something DOES. I'm guessing you're not a cyclist of any sort.

Two of the things you're pointing out as merely being incremental features - derailures and materials such as carbon fiber and the like - have fundamentally changed cycling. Not because of what today's bicycle IS... but because of what it can DO. The where, and the how, and the who.

Without derailures - multiple gears, and more importantly the ability to change gears - there'd be no mountain bikes. In fact, it would be exceedingly hard to pedal any bike up even a modest hill and down the other side without a derailure.

The lateral stiffness and vertical forgiveness that carbon fiber offers not only strengthens a road bike but makes it far more comfortable to ride - further, faster, longer. By older people. By people who are not as powerful as someone else who could stomp the pedals of a 20lb chro-moly bike of two decades ago. I'm easily doing 100mi rides today that I couldn't dream of 20-25years ago.

What appear to the naive observer to be subtle changes in frame geometry take a bike only fit for long comfortable rides and turn it into a speed demon with the right person pedaling it of course.

I could go on about tire technology (I can go 2000mi between flatting) or saddles, pedals, and handlebars (the three places where you contact the bike) or how BMX bikes influenced the entire generation of boys that spawned mountain bike or how the addition of shocks to those mountain bikes changed where mountain bikes are ridden. Or how the "where" of where mountain bikes are ridden today - by more people, further afield - has had a demonstrable impact on conservation efforts around the world.

Don't look at what something IS to try to find innovation. Look at what it lets you DO.

---------- Post added November 25th, 2014 at 12:57 AM ----------

If you reject:

Horsecollar BCD
Personal dive computers
Recreational nitrox
rebreathers

...as not really being innovation, what would you accept? Oxygum?

Cheers,
Huw

What do those things let a diver do that they couldn't do PRIOR to their introduction? In what way have they transformed the experience of diving in a meaningful way? Can you now dive somewhere different? See things you couldn't see before? Can people dive now that couldn't dive before?

Don't get me wrong, those things above are nice to have. But on the whole, I'd argue that diving is exactly the same after their introduction as it was prior.

BEFORE: Strap a tank on your back, go underwater, breath through a demand valve regulator, and look at pretty fishies.

• Horsecollar BCD
• Personal dive computers
• Recreational nitrox
• rebreathers

AFTER: Strap a tank on your back, go underwater, breath through a demand valve regulator, and look at pretty fishies.

 

[muzikbiz22]

I'm also discounting rebreathers as not yet being a recreational scuba innovation given:
1.) Low penetration rate
2.) High price barrier to broad adoption
3.) It's still really just breathing (and rebreathing) compressed gas underwater from a tank you bring with you.

I'm sure I'm missing something. Look forward to people's thoughts.

Please see Hollis Explorer Sport Rebreather. Your #1 - Not sure what you mean. #2, $4995.00 gets you in the rebreather game #3, do a little more homework. With that said, the Recreational Rebreather market is lighting it up right now, especially the Hollis Explorer. Poseidon MKVII is doing nicely, as well.

 

[kr2y5]

I'll disagree. You're not looking at what true innovation is about. Innovation isn't about what something IS. Innovation is about what something DOES. I'm guessing you're not a cyclist of any sort.

Two of the things you're pointing out as merely being incremental features - derailures and materials such as carbon fiber and the like - have fundamentally changed cycling. Not because of what today's bicycle IS... but because of what it can DO. The where, and the how, and the who.

Without derailures - multiple gears, and more importantly the ability to change gears - there'd be no mountain bikes. In fact, it would be exceedingly hard to pedal any bike up even a modest hill and down the other side without a derailure.

The lateral stiffness and vertical forgiveness that carbon fiber offers not only strengthens a road bike but makes it far more comfortable to ride - further, faster, longer. By older people. By people who are not as powerful as someone else who could stomp the pedals of a 20lb chro-moly bike of two decades ago. I'm easily doing 100mi rides today that I couldn't dream of 20-25years ago.

What appear to the naive observer to be subtle changes in frame geometry take a bike only fit for long comfortable rides and turn it into a speed demon with the right person pedaling it of course.

I could go on about tire technology (I can go 2000mi between flatting) or saddles, pedals, and handlebars (the three places where you contact the bike) or how BMX bikes influenced the entire generation of boys that spawned mountain bike or how the addition of shocks to those mountain bikes changed where mountain bikes are ridden. Or how the "where" of where mountain bikes are ridden today - by more people, further afield - has had a demonstrable impact on conservation efforts around the world.

Don't look at what something IS to try to find innovation. Look at what it lets you DO.

---------- Post added November 25th, 2014 at 12:57 AM ----------



What do those things let a diver do that they couldn't do PRIOR to their introduction? In what way have they transformed the experience of diving in a meaningful way? Can you now dive somewhere different? See things you couldn't see before? Can people dive now that couldn't dive before?

Don't get me wrong, those things above are nice to have. But on the whole, I'd argue that diving is exactly the same after their introduction as it was prior.

BEFORE: Strap a tank on your back, go underwater, breath through a demand valve regulator, and look at pretty fishies.

• Horsecollar BCD
• Personal dive computers
• Recreational nitrox
• rebreathers

AFTER: Strap a tank on your back, go underwater, breath through a demand valve regulator, and look at pretty fishies.

BEFORE: Be born, go to school, marry, have children, build a house, die from cancer....

quantum physics
the Internet
Penicillin
...

AFTER: Be born, go to school, marry, have children, build a house, die from cancer...

I think you may need a bit of clearer problem statement...

 

[RJP]

Please see Hollis Explorer Sport Rebreather. Your #1 - Not sure what you mean. #2, $4995.00 gets you in the rebreather game #3, do a little more homework. With that said, the Recreational Rebreather market is lighting it up right now, especially the Hollis Explorer. Poseidon MKVII is doing nicely, as well.

What percent of ALL recreational divers are using rebreathers these days, do you suppose? I would guess you'd need some significant rounding to get it up to even 1%. Sure, that's up 1000% from .01% five years ago. But I wouldn't consider that "lighting it up" just yet. I'm thinking a product with a $5000 price tag targeted to a customer base that buys a $3 bottle of defog from an online seller in order to save the sales tax still has a little way to go on the adoption spectrum.

Again, you're looking at what something IS. I will agree that the technology is innovative (though it's been around for decades, so...) and of anything currently out there rebreathers have the greatest shot but they haven't come close to innovating the sport yet.

---------- Post added November 25th, 2014 at 01:15 AM ----------

BEFORE: Be born, go to school, marry, have children, build a house, die from cancer....

quantum physics
the Internet
Penicillin
...

AFTER: Be born, go to school, marry, have children, build a house, die from cancer...

I think you may need a bit of clearer problem statement...

C'mon. Before penicillin an awful lot of people who got what today we would consider minor infections didn't live long enough to die of cancer... or get married... or even go to school.

 

[kr2y5]

C'mon. Before penicillin an awful lot of people who got what today we would consider minor infections didn't live long enough to die of cancer... or get married... or even go to school.

In that case, I'd think LeisurePro, or whoever first started the war between the LDS and the consumer... suddenly, more folks are buying cheap gear! Same with HOG: you can now buy 10 regulators if you want to, without worrying about recurring service cost. Whites Fusions, drysuits for less than $1000. I think examples of this sort abound, they all let more folks enjoy more of the sport that they wouldn't otherwise afford.

And, of course, ScubaBoard.

 

[Centrals]

Dive computer is probably the only item that I can think of since I started scuba diving 18 yrs ago. The basic equipment is still the same: bc(with spg and reg), gas, tank and weight.

 

[kr2y5]

Dive computer is probably the only item that I can think of since I started scuba diving 18 yrs ago. The basic equipment is still the same: bc(with spg and reg), gas, tank and weight.

Honestly, I don't know why we need a revolution... wake me up when ScubaPro innovates the Jet Fin, and makes one with a less rectangular foot pocket, or when someone makes a manifold with all valves pointing upwards, so that folks with limited mobility don't have to all go sidemount... one can probably keep going on for 48 hours straight enumerating all the obvious deficiencies that could be addressed with a similar evolutionary change, SB is full of complaints that keep repeating, but even that seems prohibitively difficult for manufacturers to pay attention to.

 

[kayakguy]

Computers. For me this is it. They have allowed divers a safety net that allows them to dive more because they have a computer to back them up. It has taken the fear of screwing up a calculation on the dive table a thing of the past and even given new divers the confidence(justified or not) to step out on their own sooner. Good or bad there it is.

 

[RJP]

Honestly, I don't know why we need a revolution...

If you worked in the industry you would...

:d

In today's world if you don't innovate and grow... you die.

I bet if you asked Ikelite if GoPro is innovative they'd sure think so. Now. Someone above said "it's just a small camera in tiny package." Again - don't look at what it IS. Look at what it DOES.

But think about it this way - just a few years ago if you wanted to take even still photos the cheapest you could get away with on gear purchase was a $200 point and shoot that required a $500 Ikelite housing and $600 worth of strobes in order to work your ass off to get even a crappy photo. Oh yeah, and when your $200 camera died... you had to throw away your $500 housing as well because it only fit that one model camera.

Video a few years ago was even worse. $1000 for decent sony video camera and $3000 for a housing. (Which you also had to throw away when you replaced your camera.)

Now? $299 gets you all-in on a GoPro.

So, because Ikelite assumed it was in the $500-$2000 housing business - and not the underwater image capture business -they lost out on the entire segment of the market that went to GoPro. They should have been smart enough to get someone to OEM them a small $200 video camera with a fixed form-factor that they could put into a fixed form-factor housing. Sell the camera upgrades every two years for $200 bucks... but let the customer keep putting it into the same $500 case. No one who owned a $500 housing would buy a GoPro if they had an upgrade path on the camera. They didn't even do that. Just like Sony had the walkman market stolen by Apple's iPod... Ikelite was one lateral thinker away from being GoPro.

Hell, if they had a decent IP attorney he would have gotten form and use patents on "clear acrylic housings sealed by use of a silicone o-ring held in place by a pressure latching mechanism for purposes of using photographic, video, or any other manner of image capture devices while protecting said devices from water, dirt, or other elements under or above water."

That way they could have just SUED GoPro for $3billion after their IPO.

---------- Post added November 25th, 2014 at 02:12 AM ----------

Interestingly, Harvard Business Review must have heard us talking. I see on twitter that HBR's archive pick of the week is Theodore Levitt's "Marketing Myopia," which was the foundation of modern marketing.

Published more than 50 years ago... it's STILL the most important piece of academic literature ever written on the subject of marketing.

http://s.hbr.org/1C5E4Js

The gist of the article is the idea that marketers should focus on meeting the customer's needs rather than on selling them products.

In the article Levitt famously suggest that if, in 1910, a buggy whip manufacturer focused on meeting their customer's need for "transportation initiation" they might have made the creative leap to a position in the automobile industry... rather than going out of business altogether.

---------- Post added November 25th, 2014 at 03:10 AM ----------

Digital photography has been big.

If only for letting liveaboards convert their E6 processing labs to spacious deck heads...