Learning to dive doubles?
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DuboisP
Contributor
redstrom
Contributor
Interesting thread. Thanks for starting it!
I have yet to dive doubles, but it is in my future.
I recently purchased a used set of 80's, together with regs and manifold. (Plus a few spare goodies, extra tanks soon to follow!) I also picked up a nearly new #40 wing, added a new SS plate and assembled the harness, but have yet to get the rig wet. I am looking to do a bit of training, sometime soon, before I simply jump in the water, just because it makes sense to me.
I am quite comfortable in my single 80 BP/W set up, but diving doubles is a bit of a game changer in my opinion, and one I see no reason to rush into without a bit of extra instruction.
Last year I sat in on one day of a couple friends' double class at Dutch Springs, before I even thought about diving doubles myself, and I can see where a bit of skilled instruction could go a long way toward making me more comfortable and proficient in any such new gear set up.
I learned the hard way, when BCD's first made their appearance, that retraining is never wasted $ or time, when it comes to life support.
I have yet to dive doubles, but it is in my future.
I recently purchased a used set of 80's, together with regs and manifold. (Plus a few spare goodies, extra tanks soon to follow!) I also picked up a nearly new #40 wing, added a new SS plate and assembled the harness, but have yet to get the rig wet. I am looking to do a bit of training, sometime soon, before I simply jump in the water, just because it makes sense to me.
I am quite comfortable in my single 80 BP/W set up, but diving doubles is a bit of a game changer in my opinion, and one I see no reason to rush into without a bit of extra instruction.
Last year I sat in on one day of a couple friends' double class at Dutch Springs, before I even thought about diving doubles myself, and I can see where a bit of skilled instruction could go a long way toward making me more comfortable and proficient in any such new gear set up.
I learned the hard way, when BCD's first made their appearance, that retraining is never wasted $ or time, when it comes to life support.
I will echo some of the initial feedback you received, before the thread took an interesting turn (although, the posted photo associated with that turn will become a 'poster child' example for all of my future PPB and AOW students.)
Like many posters, I started diving back-mounted doubles with limited/no formal training. I received some good help in assembling two tanks that I had (2 HP120s), and setting up a pair of regulators. But, I essentially set the rig up, and went to the local quarry to start practicing (albeit in anticipation of pursuing technical training in the future). Several years ago I posted my observation that I benefitted immensely from becoming familar with doubles before starting technical training, which has its own steep learning curve. But, that was my experience and it might not be the best approach for everyone. As gypsyjim noted, 'a bit of skilled instruction' might help a diver feel more comfortable.
Notably, a key element for me in learning to use doubles was setting up and diving a pony bottle, before I ever asembled a set of (back-mounted) doubles. Again anticipating future technical training, I bought a 40cf cylinder to 'sling' as my first pony bottle, and started diving with it on virtually every dive (prompting some sarcastic comments from one boat crew in Key Largo when I took it on a shallow reef dive). I regularly practiced switching, from backgas to the pony regulator to backgas, at depth, I practiced switching to the pony at a particular depth on ascent and staying on it until I surfaced, I periodically put some 36% in the pony and switched to it, from air backgas, on ascent just for the experience. By the time I set up my doubles, I was used to at least some aspects of diving with a second regulator, and a redundant air supply, and switching gases.
If what you want to do is simply take Deep Diver or Wreck Diver training, I suggest you find a shop/instructor that teaches these courses using a single tank rig, with a pony bottle. A pony is never a bad investment, having a redundant air supply is a good idea when diving deeper sites, it has a much more limited / minimal effect on buoyancy requirements and trim, and provides a vehicle for practicing skills for the future. If you want to learn to dive doubles, you can pursue the 'assisted exposure' route that many of us have used (or do it entirely on your own), or pursue more formal training through a number of agencies that offer an "Intro to Technical Diving' or equivalent course, that can introduce you to doubles. Another option, that we are beginning to use to introduce single tank divers to doubles, is an Open Water Sidemount Diver course, if one is offered in your area. It may be a good way to learn about sidemount (a very comfortable, stable diving platform) AND be introduced to diving with two tanks.
Neither Deep Diver nor Wreck Diver (at least the PADI courses) is specifically intended to cover the topic of diving doubles. Certainly, the Deep Diver course emphasizes the importance of having an appropriate gas supply, and the value of a redundant gas supply. Nonetheless, neither course would ideally be used as an introduction to doubles. In fact, I am surprised that an offering of either course would 'require' doubles - a pony I can understand. Doubles, no.
There are a variety of options available for learning to dive doubles. As several, very knowledgeable, posters have noted, diving doubles really isn't rocket science. But, the amount of gas you can carry with a set of doubles can allow you to get into trouble with regard to exceeding NDLs, the procedures for addressing equipment failures with back-mounted, manifolded doubles are specific and require some skill development and practice, and the buoyancy and trim requirements associated with doubles have to be addressed, particularly where you dive heavy steel tanks in a wetsuit.
Like many posters, I started diving back-mounted doubles with limited/no formal training. I received some good help in assembling two tanks that I had (2 HP120s), and setting up a pair of regulators. But, I essentially set the rig up, and went to the local quarry to start practicing (albeit in anticipation of pursuing technical training in the future). Several years ago I posted my observation that I benefitted immensely from becoming familar with doubles before starting technical training, which has its own steep learning curve. But, that was my experience and it might not be the best approach for everyone. As gypsyjim noted, 'a bit of skilled instruction' might help a diver feel more comfortable.
Notably, a key element for me in learning to use doubles was setting up and diving a pony bottle, before I ever asembled a set of (back-mounted) doubles. Again anticipating future technical training, I bought a 40cf cylinder to 'sling' as my first pony bottle, and started diving with it on virtually every dive (prompting some sarcastic comments from one boat crew in Key Largo when I took it on a shallow reef dive). I regularly practiced switching, from backgas to the pony regulator to backgas, at depth, I practiced switching to the pony at a particular depth on ascent and staying on it until I surfaced, I periodically put some 36% in the pony and switched to it, from air backgas, on ascent just for the experience. By the time I set up my doubles, I was used to at least some aspects of diving with a second regulator, and a redundant air supply, and switching gases.
If what you want to do is simply take Deep Diver or Wreck Diver training, I suggest you find a shop/instructor that teaches these courses using a single tank rig, with a pony bottle. A pony is never a bad investment, having a redundant air supply is a good idea when diving deeper sites, it has a much more limited / minimal effect on buoyancy requirements and trim, and provides a vehicle for practicing skills for the future. If you want to learn to dive doubles, you can pursue the 'assisted exposure' route that many of us have used (or do it entirely on your own), or pursue more formal training through a number of agencies that offer an "Intro to Technical Diving' or equivalent course, that can introduce you to doubles. Another option, that we are beginning to use to introduce single tank divers to doubles, is an Open Water Sidemount Diver course, if one is offered in your area. It may be a good way to learn about sidemount (a very comfortable, stable diving platform) AND be introduced to diving with two tanks.
DuboisP
Contributor
:mooner:I think the official diving term is "taco", although it looks more like a hotdog in the pic.
a little report for these 2 dives with my double :
- why i didn't purchase it before ?
heavy to move at surface, but a better trim under.
some work to be able to close the valves if needed.
for the second dive, i also took my S80
next time, double + S80 + 7L alu
2nd half of september, one trimix week, hoping 230 ft.
DevonDiver
N/A
230ft on Trimix.... but that's a recent photo you posted earlier in the thread? :shocked2:
DuboisP
Contributor
2011 january.
do you think i progress too fast, from 60ft air in january to 230ft trimix in september ?
you're wrong...
i'm diving since 8 years, cmas***, advanced nitrox since 3 years, TDI Trimix and CMAS normoxic trimix since 2 years and diving deep regularly (115 ft with nitrox last sunday).
sometimes, i'm diving only at 65ft
, was the cas on the pic, or when i came along with beginners
DevonDiver
N/A
I don't see any value in "years diving"... what matters is dives conducted... more specifically hours underwater on appropriate dives.
I certainly won't judge you from a photo... but from what I can see there, it doesn't match the usual training 'end state' at trimix (or lower) tech level.
That said, it's easy to configure a tech rig from searching the internet and pose for a 'perfect' photo - so I wouldn't assume competence from a photo at any time.
I certainly won't judge you from a photo... but from what I can see there, it doesn't match the usual training 'end state' at trimix (or lower) tech level.
That said, it's easy to configure a tech rig from searching the internet and pose for a 'perfect' photo - so I wouldn't assume competence from a photo at any time.
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