Most Bang For Your Buck
- Thread starter mike.chuanshi
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
OP
mike.chuanshi
Contributor
- Messages
- 105
- Reaction score
- 26
I was under the impression that these were the most commonly sought after agencies for certification. That impression was not formed from having done in-depth, quantitative research, however, and it's very likely that I'm mistaken. I checked out your comprehensive list and have to admit that I didn't realize half of those agencies were in existence. I also realize that my initial question was far too broad and that I should have been more specific. If my list is really skewed, I apologize - I'm not very knowledgeable in this area (which is why I asked the question in the first place).
For more advanced to borderline technical training, which internationally-recognized agencies might be better options?
I'm trying to identify high-value courses that might be better options than the more widely-known ones so that I can make the most of my diving budget. I've gone the PADI route so far and don't have any complaints, but the more advanced training is an area where PADI seems to back off and where other agencies may be very strong. Specifically, I'm looking at advanced nitrox, light deco, and courses that teach how to handle more complex environments and conditions.
I was going to respond with exactly what NWGratefulDiver said... but since he already said it I'll offer something else.
One way you can get a quick view (I believe) on the quality of a shop's training philosophy is to ask them not about their OW course but about their AOW course.
Ask them which dives students must take for AOW.
In my view, if they tell you that PPB is one of the "standard" (suspicious) or "required" (alarming) parts of their AOW then their Open Water course is going to suck. Why I say this is because in my experience, shops/instructors who are delaying teaching solid buoyancy control to rookie divers until the AOW level are cutting corners at the OW level. And if they're cutting corners with teaching buoyancy control, then it won't stop there. Buoyancy control is one of the most important skills (if not the most important one) to keep you safe. If a shop is cutting corners on that, then what does that say to you?
What you want to hear is that AOW consists of deep & navigation (these really *are* required) and three other dives that will benefit you or match with your interests. That *could* include PPB but if they're forcing students to take it, then they're trying to plug a hole.
As many people will tell you, the instructor makes the biggest difference. The hardest thing as a new diver (or a non-diver) looking for training it to pick up on things like I described above that are indicators of sloppy (or conversely, of good quality) training.
R..
One way you can get a quick view (I believe) on the quality of a shop's training philosophy is to ask them not about their OW course but about their AOW course.
Ask them which dives students must take for AOW.
In my view, if they tell you that PPB is one of the "standard" (suspicious) or "required" (alarming) parts of their AOW then their Open Water course is going to suck. Why I say this is because in my experience, shops/instructors who are delaying teaching solid buoyancy control to rookie divers until the AOW level are cutting corners at the OW level. And if they're cutting corners with teaching buoyancy control, then it won't stop there. Buoyancy control is one of the most important skills (if not the most important one) to keep you safe. If a shop is cutting corners on that, then what does that say to you?
What you want to hear is that AOW consists of deep & navigation (these really *are* required) and three other dives that will benefit you or match with your interests. That *could* include PPB but if they're forcing students to take it, then they're trying to plug a hole.
As many people will tell you, the instructor makes the biggest difference. The hardest thing as a new diver (or a non-diver) looking for training it to pick up on things like I described above that are indicators of sloppy (or conversely, of good quality) training.
R..
I am an SEI Instructor as well as CMAS and SDI/TDI. That said I tailor my course to the student and use elements of all courses I have taken to give the best of myself and the training. SEI allows me to add whatever material I feel is necessary for my students and to test on it as a requirement for certification.
OW class has rescue skills. As do all con ed classes I teach. Those skills change based on the student knowledge.
I don't accept AOW students without making sure they will have the rescue skills I require by the time the course is done. Either through a workshop before the course if I have a mix of students, or they are all included in the course.
Usually the latter as I only accept two students for AOW training at a time. Three if the third is an exceptional diver to begin with.
I wrote the AOW class I offer. My standards in addition to agency standards. My dives that I selected to be part of the course. Student can choose a wreck dive over search and recovery if they like. No other options are available to substitute. No fluff dives.
Once OW is out of the way I prefer they do rescue before anything else.
OW class has rescue skills. As do all con ed classes I teach. Those skills change based on the student knowledge.
I don't accept AOW students without making sure they will have the rescue skills I require by the time the course is done. Either through a workshop before the course if I have a mix of students, or they are all included in the course.
Usually the latter as I only accept two students for AOW training at a time. Three if the third is an exceptional diver to begin with.
I wrote the AOW class I offer. My standards in addition to agency standards. My dives that I selected to be part of the course. Student can choose a wreck dive over search and recovery if they like. No other options are available to substitute. No fluff dives.
Once OW is out of the way I prefer they do rescue before anything else.
If you look in terms of market share, the market for recreational training is split up like this:
1) PADI
2) everyone else
It's that simple. Most agencies that teach recreational diving are PADI clones and/or borrow heavily from PADI's didactic methods. Yes, they have all needed to add one thing and take one thing away and change the logo so they don't get sued for copyright infringement, but in some cases the differences are literally just that.
There are a few agencies, all of which are niche players, that do things very differently but the basic course content between all of the major agencies differs mostly in nuances and emphasis. As divers, we sometimes clamp onto some difference between agency A and agency B and argue heatedly that the differences have a HUGE effect on quality or the results at the end of the day but it's simply not true.
The instructor, on the other hand, makes a HUGE difference. Standards are just a check list of things that the student needs to learn. You can't build quality training with a check-list. You build quality training when you turn that check list into meaningful knowledge transfer and meaningful practical in-water experience. And the agency can't do that. They only wrote the book. It's the instructor who delivers the course.
If you take 100 divers from 30 different agencies and put them all the the water together then you *might* be able to identify where one or two of them were taught, but mostly you would be guessing. If the group of divers has 20 dives or more of experience then the only differences you're likely to see at that point are differences in individual talent and personality.
The one who has the best instructor in your area.
When it comes to these kinds of activities, your choice of buddies after certification (by a good instructor) is likely to make a bigger difference to how proficient you become than your choice of agency. Personally, I did my technical training through IANTD. I liked the idea of going with an agency with a tradition of technical diving and I knew a good instructor. What I discovered about IANTD is that their written materials suck beyond belief as compared to the PADI materials (at least when I took the course). I've heard the same about some of the other major players in the tech world. What ever way you go, one thing is essential. You need to hook up with good, experienced, tight, CAREFUL buddies after you've done your training and get out there to do the dives. If you don't do that, it won't matter much what agency's logo is on your card.
R..
First you must define "bang" some divers would say the more cards you rack up the better. Other will say the longer a instructor is teaching the better. I say what do you want to get out of the class. I am a NAUI and PADI instructor, had SDI and looked at SSI and have spoken to NASE. If by bang you mean most recognized it is PADI hands down. You want a thourough academic course NAUI may be more to your liking. Want to go diving and pick up new skills and insight a mentor might be best for you. Anyone who tells you their program is better without asking you what your goals are is selling you what they have in stock, be they dive shop, independent or a rep from any agency.
Similar threads
