Neutral buoyancy question.

[ajcyang]

Hi all,
We practiced neutral buoyancy point with fin pivot and "buddha sit" during OW course.
Does that mean I won't be able to swim 100% horizontally? Because I would be up and down due to my breathing. Especially if I control breathing (10second breathing in + out), wouldn't that make the vertical wave motion even bigger?

If you guys can kindly provide me with extra articles / threads on peak buoyancy that would be fantastic as well.

Thanks!

Edit: To clarify I meant this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-p7Pm0tSWM
How is he able to get such good neutral buoyancy while breathing?

Also, if I succeed in fin pivoting, does that mean i can directly lift up my legs into a proper trim and still be neutrally buoyant?

 

[Joost Arnold]

Hi all,
We practiced neutral buoyancy point with fin pivot and "buddha sit" during OW course.
Does that mean I won't be able to swim 100% horizontally? Because I would be up and down due to my breathing. Especially if I control breathing (10second breathing in + out), wouldn't that make the vertical wave motion even bigger?

If you guys can kindly provide me with extra articles / threads on peak buoyancy that would be fantastic as well.

Thanks!

Edit: To clarify I meant this video
Essentials of Technical Diving - YouTube
How is he able to get such good neutral buoyancy while breathing?

Also, if I succeed in fin pivoting, does that mean i can directly lift up my legs into a proper trim and still be neutrally buoyant?

How many dives did you make? Controlling your buoyancy to the level of this YouTube video takes a lot of experience. It's also important to set up your own gear and get it balanced.
Inexperienced divers often use a lot of weights (or maybe not enough) what will make it a lot more difficult to get perfect buoyancy.
If your well trimmed it's in the breathing! First make sure you have some experience and after about 50 dives (maybe sooner if you're talented) take a peak performance buoyancy class.
After that it's just experience.

 

[dfx]

You'll always be bobbing up and down slightly. If you look closely at the diver in the video, he's also going up and down as he's breathing, not a lot but still. You can minimize it to a certain extent by controlling your breathing (which you probably shouldn't try as a beginner, as you could suffer a CO2 hit), but you can't eliminate it.

 

[oldschoolto]

I just went through this very thing with my wife.... First thing I did was go down to the bottom of the pool and stood with my wife in front balanced on my outstretched arms... We moved weight around till she was just balanced..... Marked on paper log, location of all weight .... Then had her lay flat on the bottom of the pool breathing in and out learning to control her buoyancy with the volume of air in her lungs.... She learned that she could work her breathing so to stay in one spot , Because of the small time delay of the air in your lungs changing buoyancy.....

It's time well spent.... I know laying on the bottom of a pool for a hour breathing does not sound like fun.... BUT, It'll fast track you on the road to true buoyancy control .... Now that is how I taught my wife.... There are other ways.... And I'm not a DM or Instructor... Just a old northeast wreck diver..

Jim....

 

[chrpai]

The fin tip pivot as I was though starts negative with fin tips ( and probably knees ) firmly on the ground. You then add enough air to the bc so that you rise and fall based on your breathing. In the middle there is neutral buoyancy. Hovering then goes on to demonstrate that further.

The problem is all of that is done while stationary. Taking it to the next level is honing those skills so that you are properly weighted and constantly maintaining neutral buoyancy as you descend and ascend through the water column. Then you can add on properly trimmed and finally you can add on the advanced kicking techniques which are really good in a high silt environment.

Add one skill at a time until it all becomes very natural and second hand easy. Then you can start adding on other skills and watch how it affects the core skills. Eventually you'll be able to handle lots of tasks while maintaining all of this.

You're off to a good start being aware of all this so early on in your dive career. It won't happen overnight so don't beat yourself up.

 

[nimoh]

I have never liked the fin pivot or Buddha exercises. These are both things that you really never do while actually diving.

just to elaborate on oldschoolto's point about the time delay. If you are neutrally buoyant with your lungs about half full, and you inhale, you don't immediately start going up. However, if you exhale at the exact point where you are about to start going up, you can arrest the ascent immediately. Doing the same thing on the exhale, will keep you at the same depth. When first learning, you will probably find that you have to think about the timing, but over time you will probably find that your breath timing is almost automatic.

I think in theory, it could be absolutely perfect, but in practice even very good divers accidentally go up and down a few inches once in a while, but it is hardly noticeable.

 

[The Chairman]

Depth change from breathing is reduced with depth. What's fairly dramatic in the pool is far, far less so below 30-40fsw. Most new divers use their hands to compensate both trim and buoyancy and this is a very bad habit. Learn to fold your hands while diving and let only your fins do your maneuvering. If you find that you're having to scull with your hands, add a bit of air... but just a bit. It takes patience and thought to become comfortable being just neutral in the water column, but it's well worth the trouble. First, you'll notice an immediate increase in bottom time due to having more gas. You use up a lot of energy while sculling shich produces more CO2 and that triggers your breathing. I've AOW students add 20% to their bottom time by doing this one thing. Second, you won't scare all the fish away. Flailing is a sure fire way to not see a lot of fish up close. Finally, you'll soon be enjoying your dives more as you'll be more in control with far less effort.

I have never liked the fin pivot or Buddha exercises. These are both things that you really never do while actually diving.

I agree with this. None of my OW students do them and they don't kneel either.

 

[Keith.M]

Because I would be up and down due to my breathing. Especially if I control breathing (10second breathing in + out), wouldn't that make the vertical wave motion even bigger?

You can see in that video that he is not taking 10 seconds on his breaths.

The advice above was spot on. Inhale until you feel yourself just start to rise and then exhale to stop it, then inhale when you feel yourself start to fall. These are nice calm controlled breaths. You will be consious of the effort at first, but with practice you will do it naturally.

 

[chrpai]

I recently dove with a guy that traveled all the way from Arizona just to get some "real" dives in Lake Travis. He was pretty new and commented how he liked my buoyancy and trim and that he wanted to work on that. He then said he couldn't in Arizona because the dive site he has access too (don't recall the name ) was only 15-20 feet deep. I then pointed out from a math perspective how the pressure gradient works and that if he can master this in 5' - 15' of water that doing it at 100' would be cake. I hope he's doing a lot of diving back home now.

BTW, google Extreme Scuba Makeover on YouTube. I think AG has put some really good material together. I showed it to my 8 year old and she 'got it'. She said she'd want to be the "after" diver.

[video=youtube;tqSDe_AjAFY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqSDe_AjAFY[/video]

 

[The Chairman]

That's an excellent video to contrast poor vs good form. Thanks!