Newb: Suit(s) for Riviera Maya, Mexico?

[victorzamora]

Lavacore is good, but certainly not 3mm full good. It's too loose if worn on its own. Pants/shirt are equivalent to a 5mm if worn with a 3mm full suit. In fact, that's what I recommend you do if you have that in the budget. Get the Lavacore shirt/pants (or onesie) and take a 3mm full suit as well. I dove a 2mm shorty when I was there in Sept and it was chilly. I'm VERY cold tolerant, and would've liked a 3mm full suit. Another benefit of the full suit is added protection from jellies/coral IF you end up touching one. I try my hardest to not, but sometimes the current/surge puts you too close. A little protection from the abrasion is nice to have. If you get warm, grab your neck seal and open/close it quickly a few times. It'll rush cool water over you and help out a lot. If you get cold, you can add the LC one or both pieces. In the cenote, I recommend the 3mm full suit and both LC pieces.

As for the cavern dive, you're clearly set on doing it so I'm not going to dissuade you. I think a cenote dive is one of the coolest things in the world, and I say that as a Full Cave diver. I took my wife (OW only) with me on a guided cavern dive (two, actually) and she loved it. Actually considered getting Cave training. One thing I will mention is that we spent DOZENS of hours in the pool getting her trim, buoyancy, and frog kick technique where it needed to be. She looks GREAT in the water for an OW diver, and even good compared to some Cavern divers (a couple Full Cave divers I've seen), rescue divers, Divemasters, etc. She's really worked on trim/buoyancy. I will tell you, your trim/buoyancy is NOT good. It might be good for a beginner, but it's not good yet. There's simply no way. It takes dozens or hundreds of hours of doing nothing but working on it to get good. It takes hundreds if not thousands to get really good. I'm Full Cave, Deco, Overhead Deco, Cave stage, etc certified diver (read: I'm pretty good) and I still work hard at it every dive. By all means, enjoy your dive.....but do NOT overestimate your abilities. That's what gets you hurt.

 

[stuartv]

Lavacore is good, but certainly not 3mm full good. It's too loose if worn on its own. Pants/shirt are equivalent to a 5mm if worn with a 3mm full suit. In fact, that's what I recommend you do if you have that in the budget. Get the Lavacore shirt/pants (or onesie) and take a 3mm full suit as well. I dove a 2mm shorty when I was there in Sept and it was chilly. I'm VERY cold tolerant, and would've liked a 3mm full suit. Another benefit of the full suit is added protection from jellies/coral IF you end up touching one.

Good info. From earlier posts, I thought a 3mm by itself or possibly with a vest/hood deal would be enough. That said, a full 3mm plus LC shirt and pants would be getting really close to $300 - maybe even over. At which point, I would probably change gears and consider ordering a Wetwear 3mm. And then maybe spend $30 on an Oceanic 5/3mm vest/hood.

Another consideration for me is that the cenote dive (1 day, 2 dives) is probably a one-time thing for me any time in the next year or two. So, I don't want to spend a bunch of extra money just to save me from being cold on one day's dives. You said you dove the cenote in a 2mm shorty. That makes me think that LC stuff plus a 2.5mm shorty, or a 3 or 3.5mm full suit (with no LC gear) would probably be warm enough - maybe not warm, but warm enough, right? I ride a motorcycle all year round (barring actual snow or ice on the roads). I can handle being somewhat cold for a couple of hours.

As for a full suit, if the LC gear is long sleeves and long pants, would it protect me from jellies/coral? I had the impression it would, which is why I thought a shorty over it might be okay. But, if coral would tear up the LC gear or jellies would still sting through it, then I definitely want a full suit over it.

As for the cavern dive, you're clearly set on doing it so I'm not going to dissuade you. I think a cenote dive is one of the coolest things in the world, and I say that as a Full Cave diver. I took my wife (OW only) with me on a guided cavern dive (two, actually) and she loved it. Actually considered getting Cave training. One thing I will mention is that we spent DOZENS of hours in the pool getting her trim, buoyancy, and frog kick technique where it needed to be. She looks GREAT in the water for an OW diver, and even good compared to some Cavern divers (a couple Full Cave divers I've seen), rescue divers, Divemasters, etc. She's really worked on trim/buoyancy. I will tell you, your trim/buoyancy is NOT good. It might be good for a beginner, but it's not good yet. There's simply no way. It takes dozens or hundreds of hours of doing nothing but working on it to get good. It takes hundreds if not thousands to get really good. I'm Full Cave, Deco, Overhead Deco, Cave stage, etc certified diver (read: I'm pretty good) and I still work hard at it every dive. By all means, enjoy your dive.....but do NOT overestimate your abilities. That's what gets you hurt.

You and TSandM are telling me the same thing. Maybe I have the wrong impression on what to expect in a cenote cavern tour. From what I've read and the pictures I've seen, I have the impression that I would potentially be in an overhead environment, but, in the "Beginner" rated cenotes, I was expecting that it would still be like being in any big cavern. I.e. I would never be within 10 feet of a wall/floor/ceiling unless I chose to approach them that closely. Have I gotten the wrong idea? Again, I'm talking about being in a "beginner" cenote and just being in the cavern tour part, where you don't get out of sight of the light and not more than 200' from the entrance.

Please don't take my earlier posts the wrong way. I was not trying to toot my own horn about buoyancy control and trim. I was trying to relay objective observations about my own past performance. Instead of saying "I think I did pretty good - at least for a beginner", I was trying to convey somewhat factual observations about how I did so that you more knowledgeable folks can form your own opinion about how I did. My g/f was also along on the discovery dive and she did have real trouble with her buoyancy, so I have seen what a total beginner CAN look like. Where she was constantly above or below our guide (or drifting up or down past him), I stayed level with him consistently, at all depths. I have no illusions about being an expert. But, it did give me the idea that if the cenote tour matches the expectations I posted above, then I would feel reasonably confident that I would not accidentally hit any wall/ceiling/floor. If the cenote tour is going to involve closer quarters than I was thinking, then I would reconsider even going.

Thanks for all the help!

---------- Post added September 17th, 2014 at 05:23 PM ----------

One last thing: I'm very big on modularity. I have this idea that my ultimate set of gear might be:

Lavacore LS shirt and long pants
2.5mm shorty
5mm full suit
Possibly a hood or vest/hood.

That would give me options for the warmest water (2.5 shorty by itself) to fairly cold water (5mm suit plus LC gear underneath plus hood to be the equivalent of a 7mm suit). In other words, it would essentially give me 4 configs - each of the 2 wetsuits with and without the LC gear underneath. And, actually, even more if I wear the LC gear, full suit, AND the shorty.

But, I've already gotten it loud and clear that AI sounds good to a newbie and is, in reality, considered a waste of money by many/most. So now y'all have me wondering if a shorty is also really a waste of money. I am definitely prepared to listen to the voices of Experience.

 

[C Dub]

Stuart,

I'm also a pretty enthusiastic new diver. I think doing the Cenotes is a *really* bad idea, fresh off your certification. I've recently turned down several really fun sounding intermediate to advanced dives, so I know how hard it is. I suggest you slow down, type less, and dive more. Thanks for all your posts, I've learned quite a bit from the replies.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

I took my 5 mm wetsuit when I went down there over the new year. The cenotes were a bit cooler (74-ish?) than off the coast.

The day I did 5 dives in a day, I was glad I had a 5 mm wetsuit. Mind you, when I was down there, the rain season had extended itself from summer into the winter months. There were not many days where I had the full brunt of the sun.

The main piece of advice I would give is try to dive as much as possible before your trip for the experience and to slow down your air consumption. If you can, try to take a few specialty courses, like night, deep water, and drift diving. That will open up a lot of things for you.

If you wish, you can PM me or I will simply monitor this thread in case you have questions specifically for me, given you will be down there pretty much one year after I was.

 

[victorzamora]

Just to clarify, I have to say: I dove a 2mm shorty in the open water. I dove a drysuit in the cenotes.....but only because I owned a drysuit and a 2mm shorty long before going down there. If I had my choice, it would've been a 5mm full suit in the cenotes and maybe a 3mm full suit in the OW. 3mm fullsuit + LC would've given me the best modularity. It's expensive, but totally worth it if that's what you'll be diving a lot.

As for the Lavacore/Shorty combo, then maybe that would work. Lavacore on its own isn't as warm as you'd think. It will protect you from abrasions, though.

 

[fbk]

Stuart as you can tell exposure protection and response to cold is a very individual thing. I know some people who dive 5mm suits in 30C (86F) water and are cold after 1 dive. I dive all day in shorts and a rashy in anything over 25C (77F).

When I first started diving I had a 5mm 2pc because that's what I was told I would need and because 2pc would be "more versatile". I have since bought and sold more wetsuits than I can count and even bought a drysuit on a whim to try it out. I've got rid of everything except my lavacore, 3mm full suit and a $50 2mm shorty which for me are very versatile and offer all the protection I need for the diving I do (17C - 30C). That may or may not work for you, the only way to find out is to try. If you can get Lavacore or something on special grab it, it will always come in handy, even in really warm water it is ideal for protection from stings, accidental scrapes etc.

You will probably have trouble getting long sleeve LC into a full wetsuit without the arms bunching up. Short sleeve LC with or without a hood is great for wearing under any wetsuit for an extra layer if you feel you need it. Lavacore doesn't breathe so I wouldn't count on using it while on your bike or you'll end up soaked in sweat.

Most people I know consider a full 5mm the starting point. I hate wearing a wetsuit if I don't have to, I'd dive in shorts every dive if I could.

 

[stuartv]

You will probably have trouble getting long sleeve LC into a full wetsuit without the arms bunching up. Short sleeve LC with or without a hood is great for wearing under any wetsuit for an extra layer if you feel you need it. Lavacore doesn't breathe so I wouldn't count on using it while on your bike or you'll end up soaked in sweat.

Great info! The Lavacore website claims that LC is breathable. That is why I was expecting to be able to wear it on my bike.

Technology

But, LC would not be even be close to the first gear I've tried that claimed to be breathable and, in practice, was about as breathable as a piece of Saran Wrap.

And, regarding the sleeves bunching up: So I should stick with a plan of wearing a long sleeve Under Armour compression shirt as a rash guard, to help make it easier to slip my wetsuit on/off? Or maybe I just don't need anything for that?

---------- Post added September 18th, 2014 at 08:52 AM ----------

I took my 5 mm wetsuit when I went down there over the new year. The cenotes were a bit cooler (74-ish?) than off the coast.

The day I did 5 dives in a day, I was glad I had a 5 mm wetsuit. Mind you, when I was down there, the rain season had extended itself from summer into the winter months. There were not many days where I had the full brunt of the sun.

The main piece of advice I would give is try to dive as much as possible before your trip for the experience and to slow down your air consumption. If you can, try to take a few specialty courses, like night, deep water, and drift diving. That will open up a lot of things for you.

If you wish, you can PM me or I will simply monitor this thread in case you have questions specifically for me, given you will be down there pretty much one year after I was.

Thank you for the info. So, for 5 dives in a day the 5mm was good. But, if you had only done 2 dives, a full 3mm would have been okay?

 

[victorzamora]

Great info! The Lavacore website claims that LC is breathable. That is why I was expecting to be able to wear it on my bike.

My experience with it has been that it IS breathable and comfortable on land. On land, I'd probably wear a wicking-type shirt over it for your motorcycle gear just to make sure, but I'm kinda crazy like that (and have a bunch of thin wicking-type shirts anyway).

And, regarding the sleeves bunching up: So I should stick with a plan of wearing a long sleeve Under Armour compression shirt as a rash guard, to help make it easier to slip my wetsuit on/off? Or maybe I just don't need anything for that?

LC long-sleeve shirts should have a thumb loop to prevent bunching. If not, they're VERY simple to sew in place.

 

[stuartv]

Cool! Thanks for the info, Victor. Sounds like maybe I should go ahead and grab some LC while it's cheap!

---------- Post added September 19th, 2014 at 10:23 AM ----------

A new option: I found a really good deal on a 5mm Waterproof W1 on my local CL. I'm making arrangements to go try it on. I have a feeling it's going to be too small, but that's just based on the WP sizing chart. The suit is an L and from their sizing chart, it looks like they would recommend me an L/t or an XL. So, it's close enough to be worth going and trying it on.

From what y'all have posted, I'm thinking a 5mm would be okay for reef diving off Cozumel and Riviera Maya. More than warm enough, but with letting some water in at the neck, no chance of being flat-out TOO warm. And then it should be good for the cenotes and also good for Oahu in March. Yes?

Am I missing any downside to getting a 5mm? Anything in particular I should know about the WP W1? It looks like a really nice suit from what I can find on the interwebs.