Nomad JT or Bogaerts Razor 2 system??

[Dive-aholic]

drysuit.. and most likely standard al80's. cold water, and for now primary tanks only.. possibly 1 deco bottle

Do you ever plan on diving steel cylinders? If the answer is a definite no, then the JT is probably overkill. However, the lift of the Razor 2 is also overkill for AL80s with no additional cylinders.

What are your reasons for narrowing it down to these 2 systems? What are the attributes you like about them? What kind of diving are you planning on doing in sidemount?

You've missed my point. The Razor (complete system) includes an *Extra* side mount bungee & pouch. This extra SM bungee is typically carried as a spare when diving.

How are the extra bungees supposed to be changed out underwater?

The pouch is pretty significant. Thigh pockets are harder to access with SM tanks.

This is not true. With the proper technique thigh pockets are very easy to access with SM cylinders. I have no problems accessing them, even with LP108s.

 

[cool_hardware52]

How are the extra bungees supposed to be changed out underwater?

One extra bungee, the sidemount bungee is a standard item in the pouch.

Pull the damaged bungee through the harness, cut off one bolt snap if required. Fitting the replacement bungee is a "Razor" skill, but it is definitely doable.

This is not true. With the proper technique thigh pockets are very easy to access with SM cylinders. I have no problems accessing them, even with LP108s.

Others might disagree.

Tobin

 

[^Diver Derek]

might mound lp95's.. depends on whats easier. havent really looked up stats on either tanks

 

[^Diver Derek]

I mean, the majority of use would be quarry open water or great lakes diving.(some pennetration) and caves when I take intro to cave, wish i could jump into full cave but im not quite old enough

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

drysuit.. and most likely standard al80's. cold water, and for now primary tanks only.. possibly 1 deco bottle

Either will work fine I'd guess, either will require you to wear a bunch of weight I bet...

UTD Z-System

Yeah, this... just be sure to modify it by taking out all the crap that sets the Z System apart, in order to make it not retarted.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Others might disagree.

Tobin

Only because they haven't been trained in the proper way to do it.

might mound lp95's.. depends on whats easier. havent really looked up stats on either tanks

Then the JT. The Razor 2 will have a very high profile with steel cylinders.

I mean, the majority of use would be quarry open water or great lakes diving.(some pennetration) and caves when I take intro to cave, wish i could jump into full cave but im not quite old enough

Wreck penetration and cave diving (in Florida) is best done with steel cylinders. If you're not old enough for full cave, then you're not old enough for intro to cave. Same age requirements.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Then the JT. The Razor 2 will have a very high profile with steel cylinders.

Have you used or been trained to use the Razor2? The R2 has only been available for a few weeks.

Tobin

 

[Dive-aholic]

Tobin, how much experience do you have diving sidemount?

I don't have to own a Razor2 to see that in the following video from :42-:57 the BAT wing creates quite a high profile in the rig. While Steve is diving 6 AL80s in this video so the profile may not look very high, replace the 6 AL80s with 2 steel cylinders. My calculations, given an average of 1.6 lbs negative buoyancy for a full AL80 (1.4 for a Luxfer, 1.8 for a Catalina) that 6 cylinders will be negatively buoyant by 9.6 lbs. A set of Worthington LP85s filled to 2640 will be 12 lbs negatively buoyant. Add another 1000 psi to each cylinder and you're adding about 4 more lbs for a total of 16 lbs. With a small set of steel cylinders, there is 6.4 lbs more negative buoyancy than in 6 AL80s. Even if he's diving all Catalinas, that's still 5.2 lbs more negative buoyancy with the steel LP85s. This will require the BAT wing to be filled even more than in that video. And there will not be stacked cylinders to offset the appearance of the high profile, filled BAT wing.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Tobin, how much experience do you have diving sidemount?

Very little, but then I not the one commenting on SideMount Systems I haven't used........

Tobin

 

[Dive-aholic]

You shouldn't be commenting on sidemount at all.

Tell me something, Tobin. Do you have to dive every single wing out there to be able to comment on its attributes? Or do you have enough experience in building wings to know what are good attributes and what are not so good attributes and can thus comment simply by looking at a wing?

It's a little easier to do that with a sidemount system, especially when you can see it in the water being dived by the person who made it. But apparently you have nothing more you can say in response to my last post with Steve's own video.

I'm not saying the Razor2 isn't a good system. I'm saying it's not a great system for diving steel cylinders. There are better systems out there for that. I don't know all of Steve's experience, but I do know that most of his experience is diving AL80 cylinders. He should either stick to inventing systems for that type of diving or gain experience diving steel cylinders so he can design a system that will truly work with steel cylinders.