RIDIVER501:
a simple kudo thread to a dive shop that worked hard to earn A 5 star IDC rating. was immediately trolled by him
Very interesting. Seems I made an enemy when I pointed out becoming a 5 star facility is not an accomplishment, but merely a marketing tool. If I remember correctly, the original post made being a 5 star facility sound like something it is not. I tried to correct what I felt was a misunderstanding. Seems some people get angry when myths are dispelled.
RIDIVER501:
The difference if makes FF is that my experience with walter is he is a PADI bashing troll here on SB.
That depends on your definitions. If you think anyone who says something negative about PADI is a PADI basher, I qualify. If you think anyone who says something negative about PADI, without backing it up with facts, is a PADI basher, I don't qualify.
RIDIVER501:
funny how the 3 agencies evaluated in his little article are on the two he is associated with at the instructor level and the one he despises the most. Oh and the one he despises the most he has not taught for.
Sorry, the only instructor tickets I've ever held were YMCA and CMAS. I have never been a NAUI instructor, although a NAUI Instructor Trainer has encouraged me to cross over to NAUI.
You are also putting the cart before the horse. While I have long known PADI standards weren't as high as those of some other agencies, I never disliked them until after they filed suit. In fact, I was involved in very friendly discussions with a member of PADI's QA department to eliminate misgivings they had about the article. At the end of those discussions, while I still felt PADI should make their standards better, I had a positive impression of their organization. At that point I received an e-mail from my liaison from PADI's QA department praising me for fairly representing PADI in the article. Shortly after, PADI filed suit and as the suit progressed, I learned things about PADI that led to my negative impression of PADI.
RIDIVER501:
ironic how people on this board fail to realize:
1. no one agency is the end all be all of diving.
2. every agency has their own share of problems.
3. every agency has their shares of instructor who are not doing the right thing by their students or the industry.
4. winning a court battle doesn't mean the winner is right or innoccent (look at OJ)
5. there are bad divers out there who hold cards from every agency out there.
6. many bad divers are a product of their own personal lack of diving and skill development and not a product of substandard instruction. (although it easier to and more politically correct to blame the agency and instructor for a divers shortcomings)
All of those are true. No disagreement. OTOH, many divers are poorly trained not because the instructor wanted to do a poor job, but because he didn't know how to do a good job. Higher standards will help to correct this problem.
RIDIVER501:
if he wasn't out to slam Just SLAM an agency here why didn't he compare and contrast all the agencies?
It's pretty difficult and expensive to get standards from most agencies. I believe I can easily and cheaply get SSI standards and plan to add them to the comparison when I can find the time. This is also not something that can be thrown together one afternoon. Each time a new agency is added, you have to carefully look for new requirements that the previously evaluated agencies didn't seem to have. When you find such requirements, you then have to double check each agency previously evaluated to make sure nothing was missed. The reason I chose the YMCA, NAUI and PADI was, PADI is the largest and had to be included. I purchased a set of standards from a retiring PADI DM. NAUI was included because I could easily get a set of standards through a friend. As a YMCA instructor, I already had a set of Y standards.
RIDIVER501:
I wouldn't assume to comment on another agencies standards and be credible without working knowledge.
Actually, I have a great deal of experience working as a divemaster on a charter boat in ther Keys. As a divemaster, I saw many, many classes from various agencies from their first dive through certification. It soon became evident that some techniques worked well in producing quality divers while other techniques don't work well at all. I have working knowledge.
RIDIVER501:
i say again winning in court doesn't mean the winner was right.
True.
RIDIVER501:
the old truth hurts defense. who's truth? Walter's?, PADI's? Your's? Mine? irrelevant.
Sorry, but things are true or they aren't. There are various sections of my article, some are objective while others are subjective. The objective sections are true, the subjective sections are my opinions and are clearly labeled as such.
RIDIVER501:
if there were only one right way to get the job done then there would be only one agency.
All the agencies after LA County weren't started because the new agencies had a new approach. They are limited in territory covered. YMCA was the first nationwide agency. NAUI came soon after with similar techniques. PADI saw a marketing opportunity. They later lowered standards to capitalize on our instant gratification society, not to do things differently or better.
RIDIVER501:
there is good and bad with every agency, but the report by mister unbiased doesn't address it that way so who's truth sets the standard?
From the article:
"NAUI requires orally inflating a buddy's BC, neither YMCA nor PADI require this excellent skill."
"NAUI makes no mention of no mask breahing, a critical skill......"
"PADI requires a student to breathe from a free flowing regulator, NAUI has no such requirement and YMCA only added it in 2000. This is an excellent skill."
"All three agencies have room to improve."
Didn't that address it? What were you saying about truth?
RIDIVER501:
There are things that I don't agree with that other agency tout but I don't go around M-Fing them for it. Walter does.
That's just a bald faced lie. You should be ashamed.
And as for not teaching for Padi, it's evident he doesn't like their program, so why WOULD he teach for them?
