Question: When passing other diver's jump lines already in place, do you treat them like a T and mark your exit side with a cookie / REM, or do you disregard them?
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Passing Jump lines
- Thread starter lukeb
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Alaskan Scuba Dude
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missionmtb
Contributor
I was given a good-natured 'lecture' once by a local diver outside the US about marking your jump at both ends expressly to make sure others disregarded it and didn't mistake it for a T. I was also told current best practice (at least locally) is to mark a jump if it has not been marked by the person who laid it, treating it the same as a system T; reason being the jump gear could be confused by others for system line, which I guess is possible. Though I initially felt condescended-to, we observed the practice anyway because tho it seemed excessive it wasn't too much effort to just follow and wasn't too confusing. Just a PITA to have to lay and retrieve twice as many markers... My gear has swivels and differentiated loop/line color so you'd really have to space to mistake it for a T, but w/e.
Hypothetically, imagine if you laid your jump w/o marking the front on the first jump of a multi-hour dive where dozens of open circuit side mounters would encounter it. If local practice is to mark this as a T for them, they'd all have to lay a bunch of extra gear they wouldn't otherwise have and potentially get confused at the extra T in their mental navigation. Knowing this going in you'd probably just mark it out of consideration for them? Yes they would likely encounter your mark on the end and turn around but why make them swim?
In the scenario where you're the one marking a 'jump/T?' and someone pulls what ends up being their 'unmarked' jump it may appear kinda funky and confusing for you seeing your REM just chillin' there on the system line, looking different from when you laid it and making it possibly easier to miss upon exit. I personally would only mark it if I couldn't tell whether it was a T or not, but if people wanna mark errthing I don't think there's any harm in that for me either.
I think making an individual decision on what you think is right for you and the other divers sharing the system is better than following dogma for dogma's sake. Considering the complexity of the system you're in, local practice and conditions/traffic are important and generally there is more good than harm in adopting local practice as long as it does not negatively affect your safety (e.g. causing you confusion). I imagine you'd make adjustments when diving open water in Florida vs. Southern California based on the unique hazards in each, caves are no different. I've also found local divers are more than happy to let you know what they think
-M
Hypothetically, imagine if you laid your jump w/o marking the front on the first jump of a multi-hour dive where dozens of open circuit side mounters would encounter it. If local practice is to mark this as a T for them, they'd all have to lay a bunch of extra gear they wouldn't otherwise have and potentially get confused at the extra T in their mental navigation. Knowing this going in you'd probably just mark it out of consideration for them? Yes they would likely encounter your mark on the end and turn around but why make them swim?
In the scenario where you're the one marking a 'jump/T?' and someone pulls what ends up being their 'unmarked' jump it may appear kinda funky and confusing for you seeing your REM just chillin' there on the system line, looking different from when you laid it and making it possibly easier to miss upon exit. I personally would only mark it if I couldn't tell whether it was a T or not, but if people wanna mark errthing I don't think there's any harm in that for me either.
I think making an individual decision on what you think is right for you and the other divers sharing the system is better than following dogma for dogma's sake. Considering the complexity of the system you're in, local practice and conditions/traffic are important and generally there is more good than harm in adopting local practice as long as it does not negatively affect your safety (e.g. causing you confusion). I imagine you'd make adjustments when diving open water in Florida vs. Southern California based on the unique hazards in each, caves are no different. I've also found local divers are more than happy to let you know what they think
-M
In Florida you don’t. It should be easy to tell a T from a jump visually. But if there is any confusion lay a marker.
On a regular basis it doesn't matter. It should be very very obvious it's a jump line. But if ever unsure or uneasy, drop a cookie. Just not in the cluster of the other team's cookies so you don't confuse them.
Ignore them. Or, at most, make a mental sticky-note about it as a waypoint... but an unreliable one, because that jump line may not be there anymore when you get back.
More importantly: do NOT mark them yourself. A case can be pretty easily made that you're interfering with their jump which could, potentially, cause confusion among that team.
I, personally, seeing someone else's marker there would assume that someone else had used my jump (like a goddamn idiot) and I would leave the line in place.
More importantly: do NOT mark them yourself. A case can be pretty easily made that you're interfering with their jump which could, potentially, cause confusion among that team.
I, personally, seeing someone else's marker there would assume that someone else had used my jump (like a goddamn idiot) and I would leave the line in place.
You misunderstood the question.
I ignore them. When in doubt, place a marker. Most jumps are tied between arrows or to arrows. If worse came to worse, and you find yourself in a lights-out exit situation and encounter a jump line tied into a primary line that does not have an outbound marker, the jump line will be the one that can be slid back and forth. The permanent line will be fixed but the line tied to it will be movable. The same would hold true with the lights on. If you encountered a line tied into a permanent line without a marker and felt confused by what you were seeing, you could see which line could be slid back and forth. The one that moves is the temporary line.
lermontov
Contributor
wasnt there a thread on this a while back ? I thought the protocol was to use a directional cookie and the jump line to come off that ?so that any other diver can ignore it as a non system marker. if the line is removed when you return on the main its irrelevant - if it hasnt its still marked as a jump line and likewise can be ignored - maybe it was a european method
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