Military Diver
Guest
Does anyone know if SSI would know or if this is something we should maybe email them and express our concerns over?
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I've only had my new e-dress for about two months, and I am very selective as to who gets it (I have a free Yahoo one for most things). I have only used my work one in two places, ordering from PADI, and here.
Now, some-one has sold that e-dress to some-one else, as I know recieve about 10-15 spams a day. If KN sais he doesn't, I believe him, I've seen his stance and efforts to help us all stop this garbage. Also, just by the way he sets up these forums, it is obvious that he tries to protect us in every aspect.
That only leaves one... And lets just say I am not too surprised, especially after looking around the web and over and over again I see evidence that this is exactly what PADI does. PADI can't need the money that the sell their e-mail list can they?
Is this yet another example of them living upto their reputation with PADI = 'Put Another Dollar In' ???
Jon T
Now, some-one has sold that e-dress to some-one else, as I know recieve about 10-15 spams a day. If KN sais he doesn't, I believe him, I've seen his stance and efforts to help us all stop this garbage. Also, just by the way he sets up these forums, it is obvious that he tries to protect us in every aspect.
That only leaves one... And lets just say I am not too surprised, especially after looking around the web and over and over again I see evidence that this is exactly what PADI does. PADI can't need the money that the sell their e-mail list can they?
Is this yet another example of them living upto their reputation with PADI = 'Put Another Dollar In' ???
Jon T
Ho-hum...
Let's just say that I'm a web professional and have been around certain city blocks a couple of times in my day...
As far as organisations like PADI go - it is routine to sell your maillist to not just the highest bidder but to anyone who will pay... PADI, openly advertises that they do this on a regular basis. They get about $.50 per name - I know that was what we were quoted by them.
As far as SSI being aware of their name being used? I doubt they were asked. Look who we are talking about here ... They believe they own this Industry, almost as bad as Rodales.
Terkel
Let's just say that I'm a web professional and have been around certain city blocks a couple of times in my day...
As far as organisations like PADI go - it is routine to sell your maillist to not just the highest bidder but to anyone who will pay... PADI, openly advertises that they do this on a regular basis. They get about $.50 per name - I know that was what we were quoted by them.
As far as SSI being aware of their name being used? I doubt they were asked. Look who we are talking about here ... They believe they own this Industry, almost as bad as Rodales.
Terkel
OP
King_Neptune
Founder
WetDane, your point is taken and valid ... As far as PADI and SPAM ... To be honest I thought PADI's spam policy was widely known, we have hear other companies here account to using these "Services" before they fully understood what it meant...
How many of you follow Diverlink.com's SPAM WARNING pages?
Many of you have emailed us and mentioning that PADI is almost always and forever at the top of the list. They don't even try to hide it. Well, is it any new revelation that you will find that when certain org's get a certain size they tend to think they are untouchable... I mean many have tried to take on PADI about this SPAM stuff and they wont even answer...
*Sigh* ... so what can we do?
Well, complaining right to them does ZERO good as many of us have seen. And even worse they will probably just use that address you use in the next Spam-o-rama ... Their practices have hurt us many times and we have never got a response from them.
I can assure you, turnerjd, that spam stops here, not starts here.
Let me show you just how damaging it is to us and you will see why I take such a HARD stance on it...
ScubaHosting.com - more than 25 Domain names we use for FREE EMAIL and FREE HOSTING .... Not a single one of those Domains, not even the newest of them, have less than 7500 users, we are well over 150,000 actually.
Now people use those here and there and that's exactly what they are for... but ... Let us pretend for a minute that there is ONLY 5000 accounts on each domain and that's it...
(I can assure you the number is MUCH higher than that)
These sites (more than 300 domains) sit on a beefed up DELL POWEREDGE 3200, which is Dual PenIII with more than 2 GIGs of RAM and U160 SCSI RAID 5 with better than 100 GIGs of HDD space and run a flavor of Unix ... Basically a server that not only holds its own but outshines most of all the others...
3 times now this server has been dropped to its knees and almost seriously damaged buy a Certain Other site (not PADI) that like to spider websites and spam those email addresses. Now, lets pretend to stick with small numbers of only 5000 users per domain? Well that's 125,000 accounts that get NAILED ... ALL AT ONCE!
Some of them multiple times, some accounts are full and the mail bounces and the default is for servers to keep trying for many more attempts over the next few days... So let's double that number, which is again on the low end, and that is ... 250,000 emails ... In a very short period of time! There are days they do this back to back too!
So far we can only think of 1 solution ... and because many people here use their free email address they offer we have been trying to hold off but we have just about had our hands tied here. Even if we just block their domain that is a serious load on our server. This is why there are laws against this sort of Spamming... I want to smack people when they say, "spam doesnt really hurt anyone" .. UGH!
=-)
How many of you follow Diverlink.com's SPAM WARNING pages?
Many of you have emailed us and mentioning that PADI is almost always and forever at the top of the list. They don't even try to hide it. Well, is it any new revelation that you will find that when certain org's get a certain size they tend to think they are untouchable... I mean many have tried to take on PADI about this SPAM stuff and they wont even answer...
*Sigh* ... so what can we do?
Well, complaining right to them does ZERO good as many of us have seen. And even worse they will probably just use that address you use in the next Spam-o-rama ... Their practices have hurt us many times and we have never got a response from them.
I can assure you, turnerjd, that spam stops here, not starts here.
Let me show you just how damaging it is to us and you will see why I take such a HARD stance on it...
ScubaHosting.com - more than 25 Domain names we use for FREE EMAIL and FREE HOSTING .... Not a single one of those Domains, not even the newest of them, have less than 7500 users, we are well over 150,000 actually.
Now people use those here and there and that's exactly what they are for... but ... Let us pretend for a minute that there is ONLY 5000 accounts on each domain and that's it...
(I can assure you the number is MUCH higher than that)
These sites (more than 300 domains) sit on a beefed up DELL POWEREDGE 3200, which is Dual PenIII with more than 2 GIGs of RAM and U160 SCSI RAID 5 with better than 100 GIGs of HDD space and run a flavor of Unix ... Basically a server that not only holds its own but outshines most of all the others...
3 times now this server has been dropped to its knees and almost seriously damaged buy a Certain Other site (not PADI) that like to spider websites and spam those email addresses. Now, lets pretend to stick with small numbers of only 5000 users per domain? Well that's 125,000 accounts that get NAILED ... ALL AT ONCE!
Some of them multiple times, some accounts are full and the mail bounces and the default is for servers to keep trying for many more attempts over the next few days... So let's double that number, which is again on the low end, and that is ... 250,000 emails ... In a very short period of time! There are days they do this back to back too!
So far we can only think of 1 solution ... and because many people here use their free email address they offer we have been trying to hold off but we have just about had our hands tied here. Even if we just block their domain that is a serious load on our server. This is why there are laws against this sort of Spamming... I want to smack people when they say, "spam doesnt really hurt anyone" .. UGH!
=-)
Old HammerHead
Guest
I have finally just blocked Rodales and PADI both!
I had too, the Spam loads were just getting heavier and heavier!
We, as a community, need to speak out to them and maybe, just maybe, they will listen...
Just my $0.02
I had too, the Spam loads were just getting heavier and heavier!
We, as a community, need to speak out to them and maybe, just maybe, they will listen...
Just my $0.02
OP
King_Neptune
Founder
I have received many related emails and a few PM's asking what could be done about the increasingly obnoxious load of SPAM certain sites believe is smart to send.
For those that send me msg's asking, I mentioned I would point the way here... Well, this thread and the one mentioned at the top are perfect examples of how to handle these sites...
Trust me, they will learn! This site does not exist any longer - They LEARNED!
=-)
KN
For those that send me msg's asking, I mentioned I would point the way here... Well, this thread and the one mentioned at the top are perfect examples of how to handle these sites...
Trust me, they will learn! This site does not exist any longer - They LEARNED!
=-)
KN
and devoted a particularly large amount of time to fighting it when I ran an ISP.
I was one of the first to have a "spam blocker" that was individually configurable by customers, but ALSO had a default setting that was available for users who didn't want to take the time to do their own work.
The irony of it is that Amazon.Com got caught in it once - for spamming me!
I had an amusing exchange with their corporate folks when they found out I had stuck them in my firm's default "spam killer".
I was one of the first to have a "spam blocker" that was individually configurable by customers, but ALSO had a default setting that was available for users who didn't want to take the time to do their own work.
The irony of it is that Amazon.Com got caught in it once - for spamming me!
I had an amusing exchange with their corporate folks when they found out I had stuck them in my firm's default "spam killer".
Rooster1
Guest
Spammers like telephone solicitors (the worst) should be put on display and beaten with a DIR 7 foot rubber hose for every person they spam and call to sell their crap!:upset:
kalvyn
Guest
I used to admin at an ISP, and I remember the brouhaha over the initial Amazon spams. We took to calling them "Spamazon", and to this day I've never done business with them over their stance on spamming. The ISP I worked at also had a default set of Procmail filters customers could turn on (or roll their own, of course). They also use the ORDB and MAPS system-wide spam-blocking services, something perhaps you should look into, King_Neptune.Genesis once bubbled...
and devoted a particularly large amount of time to fighting it when I ran an ISP.
I was one of the first to have a "spam blocker" that was individually configurable by customers, but ALSO had a default setting that was available for users who didn't want to take the time to do their own work.
The irony of it is that Amazon.Com got caught in it once - for spamming me!
I had an amusing exchange with their corporate folks when they found out I had stuck them in my firm's default "spam killer".
On a personal note King, I would *strongly* suggest that you disable telnet services on your server (Red Hat, huh? I prefer Debian, but I'm a propellerhead...), and use strictly OpenSSH to get to it remotely.
Jimmie
*shrug* First, I'd suggest putting up real defenses for dictionary attack spam (Telerama had a paper at LISA 2002 about their technique). Noone has 250k valid email addresses for scubasource domains... at least, they didn't until after the dictionary attack.
Actually, I often wish I knew Tech Admin personally, as reports such as KN's just annoy me with a lack of technical details.
Don't buy from email spammers, of course, but please don't think it makes that large a difference what you personally do in regards to UCE. ScubaBoard didn't shut down AtlasDivers, business incompetence did. The marginal cost to spam is often so low that 1 or 2 sales can entirely make up for it *sigh*
RedHat, huh? I just (this winter) migrated our RH6.2 web server over to FreeBSD And yes: Debian rocks
Actually, I often wish I knew Tech Admin personally, as reports such as KN's just annoy me with a lack of technical details.
Don't buy from email spammers, of course, but please don't think it makes that large a difference what you personally do in regards to UCE. ScubaBoard didn't shut down AtlasDivers, business incompetence did. The marginal cost to spam is often so low that 1 or 2 sales can entirely make up for it *sigh*
RedHat, huh? I just (this winter) migrated our RH6.2 web server over to FreeBSD
And yes: Debian rocks Similar threads
