Show some respect... bug hunters at Casino Point

[drbill]

The dive community has long treated the Casino Point Dive Park as a de facto marine reserve so the critters in it would be there for all to see and enjoy.

However, there are those who take advantage of this and take lobster from it. Weeks before season started, we were seeing discarded carapaces with no tails suggesting that divers had been taking them. The night after season opened, someone took at least one bug and left the antennae and many legs discarded within the wall at the dive park steps.

Eventually I hope those who disrespect the Fish & Game laws are caught and punished. Poachers leave a bad taste in my regulator. Those who disrespect the desire of most of the dive community to protect Casino Point for others to enjoy deserve my ire as well.

In addition to removing bugs from that ecosystem, you are making them leery of us no take divers as well. I noticed a few weeks before season began that the lobster I tried to film at night became very skittish when my video lights caught them. Prior to that they were much less so.

Show some respect! I realize the vast majority of divers do not do such things, so this is directed at the few who do. Come December hopefully we can bring legal action against these few... or vigilante justice. Using a speargun is illegal in City waters... but apparently not topside from my read of the ordinance!

 

[Mo2vation]

Hunting in the dive park. Pretty limp.

What next, the Long Beach Aquarium?

Your need to be a hero is not greater than my need to enjoy these creatures year after year in the dive park.

Grip your tiny stones and go hunt someplace else.

Hunting is OK. Hunting is not OK here.


-Ken

 

[Peter_C]

I wish they would turn the dive park into a reserve, sooner rather than later

 

[Leejnd]

I wish they would turn the dive park into a reserve, sooner rather than later

Not that it would matter. Scumbags are going to be scumbags regardless of the laws.

I was so happy to see DFG on opening night. They boarded our boat and checked all the bugs and licenses. There was a drunk lunatic on a small powerboat hoop-netting nearby, who'd been threatening us divers, apparently because he thought he owned the bugs on that part of the island. Well, DFG boarded him and caught him dumping a whole bucket of shorties overboard. Big ol' citation. Yay.

 

[Mo2vation]

We see the DFG almost every night right now - they're still out there in force.

And I'm very glad for it.

-K

 

[Rainer]

I'm assuming people are taking lobsters there (legally) to eat, not to be any sort of hero. For those taking bugs illegally (no license, before season, shorts, not keeping lobster whole, etc), then that's bad regardless of where it's being done.

Why not work on making the park a reserve (which I'd support) instead of talking about vigilante "justice"? I, too, would prefer if people left all the critters in the park in the park, but I can't see myself getting too worked up if someone decides to take some legally.

 

[on_two_wheels]

Why not work on making the park a reserve (which I'd support) instead of talking about vigilante "justice"? I, too, would prefer if people left all the critters in the park in the park, but I can't see myself getting too worked up if someone decides to take some legally.

I think the good doctor was merely speaking with passion, not suggesting we remove the poachers legs. That's his home. He's often asked about all things dive park so if he speaks in this manner, I think as a so cal community we heed his words in appreciation for the infinite amount of knowledge he has shared with new, visiting and even experienced divers.

Love mo2vation's comment: "what's next." Hunting in the park is just silly.

 

[drbill]

I, too, would prefer if people left all the critters in the park in the park, but I can't see myself getting too worked up if someone decides to take some legally.

That's part of the problem. Unless people are doing something illegally, too many people don't care. What about the 99% of other divers that dive in the park to enjoy seeing things that they can't elsewhere because those areas have already been fished out?

A different example. You lose an expensive piece of tech (or other) dive gear. Someone finds it underwater a few days later. Legally they may have every right to keep it as salvage. Ethically most would say they have a responsibility to return it to the rightful owner if that can be determined.

In a society where people only care about "legality" and not about what should be ethical we get what we've got today. I would hope most divers would shun those who take from places like the park.

As for it becoming a fully legally sanctioned marine reserve, that should happen before the end of the year. When it does, enforcement wuill require more than the CDF&G. It will require the efforts of all divers who really care about the marine environment.

Of course I wouldn't use a speargun on these people. I don't use one on fish either. However, once the protections become law I certainly will be happy to make a citizen's arrest.

 

[Rainer]

That's part of the problem. Unless people are doing something illegally, too many people don't care. What about the 99% of other divers that dive in the park to enjoy seeing things that they can't elsewhere because those areas have already been fished out?

I'd like to see lobsters at every dive site I visit, not just the dive park. Should I get worked up about people taking lobsters legally at those spots, too?

A different example. You lose an expensive piece of tech (or other) dive gear. Someone finds it underwater a few days later. Legally they may have every right to keep it as salvage. Ethically most would say they have a responsibility to return it to the rightful owner if that can be determined.

Same as the lobsters for me. I'd *like* for them to give back the gear (as I'd *like* people to leave the critters alone), but I'm not going to freak out if they don't. If you feel passionately about an issue, work to change the law.

In a society where people only care about "legality" and not about what should be ethical we get what we've got today. I would hope most divers would shun those who take from places like the park.

There's nothing unethical about legally hunting non-endangered species (assuming you don't waste what you take). That you'd rather look at them and someone else rather eat them doesn't make one of you more ethical.

I think education (rationally making your case about why you think lobsters should be left in the park) is probably a much better tool than "shunning" (or a spear gun...). If some still choose to take, and the law remains unchanged, so be it. Some will complain about the ethics of those who hunt at all (anywhere), others about the ethics of those who would tell another when or where he can hunt. The law is what we have. Thankfully, it *can* be changed, so that's one avenue to take (and from what you've written, it sounds like that's what is happening).

As for it becoming a fully legally sanctioned marine reserve, that should happen before the end of the year. When it does, enforcement wuill require more than the CDF&G. It will require the efforts of all divers who really care about the marine environment.

That's great. I'm in total support.

Of course I wouldn't use a speargun on these people. I don't use one on fish either. However, once the protections become law I certainly will be happy to make a citizen's arrest.

Seems a little off to joke about killing/hurting those with whom you disagree.

 

[Mo2vation]

I'm assuming people are taking lobsters there (legally) to eat, not to be any sort of hero. For those taking bugs illegally (no license, before season, shorts, not keeping lobster whole, etc), then that's bad regardless of where it's being done.

Why not work on making the park a reserve (which I'd support) instead of talking about vigilante "justice"? I, too, would prefer if people left all the critters in the park in the park, but I can't see myself getting too worked up if someone decides to take some legally.

Just because its legal doesn't make it right.

Legal is a very poor benchmark for what is proper and not. Bad form, and not. Ethical, and not. Courteous, and not.

There is no defensible reason to take lobster from the dive park. Not one. Are you really thinking what we're seeing here is sustenance hunting in the dive park? On a resort island? Really?

They're being taken for sport. They're being taken for greed. They're being taken for vanity. They're being taken under cover of night. They're being taken so someone can show someone else how badass they are.

Just because its legal doesn't make it right. Its chicken$hit, and people who do this are selfish cowards.

The dive park IS a protected place. You know who protects it? WE DO. The divers who dive there do. The divers who love it do.

Its the divers that chase the goobers off the breakwall who are fishing in the park. Its the divers who chase out the boaters who blast over the line. Its the divers who will confront, ask, shame and scorn and drive these idiot bug hunters off the property.

The park IS a protected place. The fact you feel no pride of ownership, no sense of duty to keep it free of hunters, and feel no loss when the place is hunted, simply because its legal is all OK. No worries. On this we will continue to disagree.

My strong assertion remains: the dive park IS protected.

Its protected by us.

Two seasons ago, on a twilight dive - a guy rolled out with a lobster bag. Three bugs in it. Claudette went over and spoke to the guy (he was set up near us) - we respectful told the guy what the purpose of the park was. We talked about its use, its history.

He went and put the bugs back.

Its protected by us.



-Ken