Steel tank Wetsuit question

[Braunbehrens]

I'll make an argument for you, Genesis, even though I still think you are wrong.

You could potentially dump less weight by dumping gas. You could futz around and dump just enough to be able to swim your rig up.

However, I think we are being unrealistic here. Unless you've had a suit failure and a wing failure you won't have a big problem getting off the bottom. If you've had both of those failures, then it means that the excrement has hit the rotating blades device in a big way. You want to GET OUT. Not sit on the bottom, look at your gauge, and vent your regulator.

Texas Tony, I know you've been itching for someone to reply to this. A bag is somewhat useful in these situations, but unless you practice this skill often, it will be very hard to control the buoyancy with the bag.

It does occur to me however that I always carry a 6lb surface marker. This would probably not be as bad to use, since it doesn't have so much lift. Still, I'd drop a small weight before clipping myself to anything and inflating it. That just sounds like a really bad idea.

Genesis, as for the 500lbs on the deck of the boat rule...well, this is mostly taught to novice divers. Obviously you don't want to breathe any tank completely dry, if you can avoid it. Also, surface conditions may make some gas a very necessary luxury, such as swimming hard through chop to catch a current line. You certainly don't want to plan on using all your gas. I think it makes sense to teach new divers to PLAN on being back on the boat with 500 psi. If they show up with less, they should figure out what happened and learn from that. Once you progress beyond a certain level no one gives a rats behind about that rule anymore, since you are more concerned with rules of thirds, rock bottom, etc.

 

[Krisscuba]

I do not see the point, steels with a wet suit?

I have been certified since 74, live in Florida and dive every chance. Anyone interested in diving drop me a line.

Use the tank appropriate for the dive. If everyone in the group, on the boat etc have 80's and you use air at the same rate, use a 80.

Question which has more air, AL 80 rated at 3300 psi with 2000 psi in it or a steel 72, rated at 2250 PSI, with 2000 psi in it (really a 65, only a 72 on first hydro date with + overstamp allowing 10% over fill.) It is the the steel. An 80 is only an 80 at 3300 psi, at 2000 psi it is about 35% empty around 50 - 60 cu the steel is only 10% empty, has a little more air.

A couple of pounds does not matter, that's what a BCD is for. Are you talking about a 2mm wet suit or a farmer john 7mm. Do you have no fat on your body or are you 70lbs over wieght?
tanks

Kris

Have these bumper stickers for sale

 

[Walter]

The 72 also has more air than a standard AL 80 (rated at 3000 PSI) when they are at the same pressure.

I don't know why you'd let what tank everyone else is using determine what tank you'll use.

I don't own any AL tanks, nor am I likely to. I'm not going to rent an AL 80 just so I'll have the same tank as everyone else on the boat.

 

[Krisscuba]

I did not mean to implie that one would rent a tank to have thesame as other. I enjoy my steel 72better then any other. I do have 8 AL 80's from teaching as is normally what the student s would find. I want to get rid of them for smaller tanks.

Ift sounded as if the person was trying to decide what type of tank to get.

I only ment that if you are in the market for a tank get one that meets the conditions. If you are diving with people that only use 72's iwould not buy a 100.

the real concern sounded as one of compensating for a couple of pounds with a wet suit.

I ve been certified since 74, lived in Hawaii, California, Wisconsin and Florida. extreme differnces in diving conditions, using no wet suit, 3mm shorty, 2mmm long 7mm farmer. tanks from double 48, 72, triple 30's and Al 80's. The problem or thought has never crossed my mind.

 

[scubatexastony]

Braunbehrens,

Texas Tony, I know you've been itching for someone to reply to this. A bag is somewhat useful in these situations, but unless you practice this skill often, it will be very hard to control the buoyancy with the bag.

Let's practice......but......

It does occur to me however that I always carry a 6lb surface marker. This would probably not be as bad to use, since it doesn't have so much lift. Still, I'd drop a small weight before clipping myself to anything and inflating it. That just sounds like a really bad idea.

Never clip a lift bag to yourself and inflate it! Shoot the bag and climb the line.....

tony

 

[Genesis]

You can put your (useless, since your inflator is worthless with a dead BC) left arm through the straps of the bag, put some gas in it, and it will provide lift while its VERY easily released if things get out of hand. I agree that clipping it to yourself is dangerous, but you don't need to do that.

You ain't going to get 10lbs of "pull" climbing the line if its regular cave line. Oh sure, you CAN, but that line is not made for climbing - way too thin and difficult to get a good grip on.

 

[Braunbehrens]

scubatexastony once bubbled...
Never clip a lift bag to yourself and inflate it! Shoot the bag and climb the line.....

tony

I agree with you, but I'm wondering. If the bag only has 6 lbs of lift, and it's the beginning of the dive...you know that you have 15 lbs of gas in your tanks.

Just thinking out loud here...

Also, 6lbs is something you could swim against, up OR down.

I do agree that as a rule clipping yourself to ANYTHING is foolish.

 

[Se7en]

I gotta ask

What the hell is the point of a 6 lbs lift bag? Why would you bother carrying something that small? The only things I've seen smaller than about 50 lbs are those tacky plastic 'safety sausages' that split as soon as you look at them - and they'd still be 20 lbs plus.

Buy some real gear.

Se7en

 

[Braunbehrens]

Se7en once bubbled...
I gotta ask

What the hell is the point of a 6 lbs lift bag? Why would you bother carrying something that small? The only things I've seen smaller than about 50 lbs are those tacky plastic 'safety sausages' that split as soon as you look at them - and they'd still be 20 lbs plus.

Buy some real gear.

Se7en

It's not a lift bag, it's a surface marker.

It's very well made, and it's not going to split or anything like that. I usually shoot it at the 70 ft stop. It has the dual purpose of giving you a reference for your stops and signaling your position to the boat. I have 3 other lift devices... a huge surface marker, an 80 lb lift bag, and a raft. Depending on the dive I may put one of these in the pocket behind my back, but usually I don't. The small surface marker has the added advantage that it fits in the drysuit pocket and is very easy to deploy.

Here is a link to the surface markers I carry. I have the the tiny one and the huge one.

http://www.halcyon.net/mc/dam.shtml

and here is a link to the raft

http://www.halcyon.net/mc/shuttle.shtml

Thank you for the advice to buy "real gear". I had been planning on diving with my fake tanks (double 104's) and my fake exposure protection (drysuit) and fake deco cylinders (Luxfer AL40's) from my fake boat (Boston Whaler Montauk). I will now go and buy real ones. Would you be so kind as to tell me where I can find some?
;-)

No offense, but I just couldn't let it slide.

 

[Krisscuba]

If you are really having a problem with it you can do what we did before we had BCD's. We would use a drop weight. Weights with a clip hook on them attached t a ring or a weight in hand. When we got to the bottom of the achor line, our suits and body fat compressed making us neg heavy. We would leave the weights at the anchor line and retreive them on our wway back to the surface