That's true about everything that's in the paper though. The reporter isn't usually an expert on anything except writting (if that). They just interview people and gather information and attempt to write it up. Since they don't understand all the terminology or the meaning of what was told to them they botch it up when the reword it.
Student drowns in scuba class off Pompano
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That's true about everything that's in the paper though. The reporter isn't usually an expert on anything except writting (if that). They just interview people and gather information and attempt to write it up. Since they don't understand all the terminology or the meaning of what was told to them they botch it up when the reword it.
PhotoTJ
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Every time!
BIGSAGE136
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The part about the firefighter is from local television coverage last
night. Out of respect I just couldnt post anything but kept wondering. On channel 4 it was told that the fire fighter pulled them both out. Still.. just too many hows & whys. After just getting certified after a 10 year lay off with some confederate
diving in the bahamas (family) I have been keeping a keen eye on the operations of the LDS's and watching the c-card issues in the various threads. One thing stands out. The instructor lost the student. Mind you this is a 60 year old person unfamiliar with this
particular stretch of water..IMO he should have been on her like a
tar ball on bare feet at the port.
night. Out of respect I just couldnt post anything but kept wondering. On channel 4 it was told that the fire fighter pulled them both out. Still.. just too many hows & whys. After just getting certified after a 10 year lay off with some confederate
diving in the bahamas (family) I have been keeping a keen eye on the operations of the LDS's and watching the c-card issues in the various threads. One thing stands out. The instructor lost the student. Mind you this is a 60 year old person unfamiliar with this
particular stretch of water..IMO he should have been on her like a
tar ball on bare feet at the port.
Good point BIGSAGE136. There isn't any time when it's acceptable to leave an uncertified student unsupervised. Getting seperated from a student is a real no-no. For this reason it's a good idea to have one or more assistants regardless of the number of students. All it takes sometimes is to look away for a second.
IMHO, the instructor was 1) the buddy and 2) the instructor..he had 2 roles which meens he should have been twice as more alert/aware/with his buddy/student...however you want to put it! Still sad! Students, not only in diving, put their trust (and in this case, possibly, their life) in the hand of their instructor. When I look for an instrutor, I try to ask myself, "Do I trust this person with my life?"
This whole story bothers me. For one thing... it appears that there were only the two of them in the water. The instructor only had to keep an eye on one person and that broke down? How. What's the vis like there? 25' 50' 100' ??? I don't know -- anyone?
I tend to ascribe to the point of view that there's something we don't know. In fact... I tend to believe that the "story" we're hearing has little to do with the truth.
Sad... really really sad.
~frown~
I tend to ascribe to the point of view that there's something we don't know. In fact... I tend to believe that the "story" we're hearing has little to do with the truth.
Sad... really really sad.
~frown~
BIGSAGE136
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Yesterday was not a good day to dive. It wasnt a good day to go out period. At best viz was 10' with lots of sand being stirred up. Cant speak for farther out to the 2nd reef line but the 1st was
absolutely low viz. On top of that we had a storm front with easterly winds. Anytime we get easterlies on the east coast of
South Florida you get rip tides. The locals know this and how to manage them. If you dont however and get caught by surprise it can be a frightening experience. The only thing that makes sense to me is that the poor student was knocked off of her feet and swept out with a low or uninflated bc. The bottom dips about 10-20' out and she would have hugged the bottom if she got ripped. If her reg got knocked away and she couldnt see she probably panicked. IMO the instructor did too. If you know that bottom and could see the rips you would know where to look. Thats the only way I can explain the FF going right to the victim. Still.. this is supposition. There is too much unknown here
absolutely low viz. On top of that we had a storm front with easterly winds. Anytime we get easterlies on the east coast of
South Florida you get rip tides. The locals know this and how to manage them. If you dont however and get caught by surprise it can be a frightening experience. The only thing that makes sense to me is that the poor student was knocked off of her feet and swept out with a low or uninflated bc. The bottom dips about 10-20' out and she would have hugged the bottom if she got ripped. If her reg got knocked away and she couldnt see she probably panicked. IMO the instructor did too. If you know that bottom and could see the rips you would know where to look. Thats the only way I can explain the FF going right to the victim. Still.. this is supposition. There is too much unknown here
It would be interesting to know how much air was in the student's tank when they found her.
Here's the thing... if there was a strong rip, he should have (a) known it (b) made her aware of it including a brief on what to do and (c) have been doubly alert. Likewise, if the vis was 10', he should have never been beyond arms reach of her.
To be honest... I feel badly for both she and the instructor. he's got to live with this the rest of his life regardless of whether or not he could have prevented it. I'm not trying to rip him, I'm just trying to understand how this could have happened.
There's nothing more tragic than a drowning when there's the means to float forever including a full tank of air and two functioning regulators on the victim's back. It's just sad beyond description to me.
Here's the thing... if there was a strong rip, he should have (a) known it (b) made her aware of it including a brief on what to do and (c) have been doubly alert. Likewise, if the vis was 10', he should have never been beyond arms reach of her.
To be honest... I feel badly for both she and the instructor. he's got to live with this the rest of his life regardless of whether or not he could have prevented it. I'm not trying to rip him, I'm just trying to understand how this could have happened.
There's nothing more tragic than a drowning when there's the means to float forever including a full tank of air and two functioning regulators on the victim's back. It's just sad beyond description to me.
ScottyK
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I have a question that maybe some of the instructros or DM's can answer. Why so far from shore, and why the long surface swim?
When I did my OW, the DM secured a float with a line that ran along the "bottom" back to shore. They had us walk in about chest deep, submerge right there, and we each got escorted out to the training area along the bottom.
We had several miscellaneous problems as people tried to submerge, including a student who had a major claustrophibic attack from the 2' vis as soon as she went down. The advantage to doing it this way, in my eyes, was that these things all went wrong in 5' of water, and about 5' from shore.
Is it common for a class to be taken that far out on the surface before trying to get everyone under? Just wondering......
Scott
When I did my OW, the DM secured a float with a line that ran along the "bottom" back to shore. They had us walk in about chest deep, submerge right there, and we each got escorted out to the training area along the bottom.
We had several miscellaneous problems as people tried to submerge, including a student who had a major claustrophibic attack from the 2' vis as soon as she went down. The advantage to doing it this way, in my eyes, was that these things all went wrong in 5' of water, and about 5' from shore.
Is it common for a class to be taken that far out on the surface before trying to get everyone under? Just wondering......
Scott
Before I answer this question for myself, I would hasten to point out that I would caution against characterizing anything as "common" as every situation and instructor will differ to one degree or another.
In limited vilibility like that where I'm going to have a hard time keeping an eye on my students, I would either take them in two at a time as a buddy team (while the rest waited on shore or on the boat) or I would take one student with me as their "buddy". Each buddy team would either hold hands or hold a guide line so as to ensure they are not separated. At no time would I allow myself to be more than an arms reach from the students.
In rough surface conditions and/or heavy rain, I would get the students under the water as quickly as I could. It's a less chaotic environment. A 300' surface swim in a storm strikes me as kinda odd.
I know that when I beach dive with students I always prefer to get them under water at the earliest reasonable point but I do have to balance between that and consideration for how much air they will consume getting from the point of entry to the point at which the skills evaluation will be performed. However, given the relatively shallow depths of most beach training dives, that's not normally a problem (air consumption).
I don't know the dive conditions at this location. It could well be that they needed to go that far out to get to 15' of depth and the instructor wanted his student to do a vertical decent. I dunno. I wouldn't dream of trying to guess his intent.
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