Question TDI CCR AIR DILUENT DIVER COURSE cost

[broncobowsher]

I can't think of a single agency that makes divers do deep air before allowing them to use Trimix. With TDI for OC you can go directly to Advanced Nitrox / Helitrox as your first tech course using Helium which is the only way I will teach it.

The no Helium for Air Diluent No Deco is because the depth limit is set to 100' which is a good starting point for most CCR divers. If the diver has the correct OC tech background they can start the Helitrox CCR course and use helium in the unit for their first course. So everything you mentioned is not really correct...

Although I didn't get trained via Ben (even though he is probably the best and closest instructor around me) I did fall into the category he is talking about. My first round of rebreather diving was 100' no deco cert. Which looking back on it, was the right call. I had been doing some 150' deco OC stuff, but not a ton. My skills were not that sharp, and sadly, still are not. But I did a ton of rebreather diving in that 100' recreational window and went back for round 2. After going through helium and deco with a rebreather (not that hard, but bailout can get complex in the planning side of things) it was best I spent a year just learning the basics of a rebreather.

 

[Tracy]

You don't think that it is better to teach these poor unlucky folks to do it right as much as possible, down to 45m, instead of them not doing it right and having a much higher chance of getting seriously hurt? I am not talking about going down to 60m or deeper, just to 45 - 50m.

No. I don't think new tech divers should be dealing with narcosis and CO2 on top of already being task loaded with new skills during a course.
I believe if you can't get a suitable gas for a dive, then you don't make that dive. That line may get blurred later with a lot of experience to back up the skills, but not when they are new to everything and taking their first technical course.

 

[BoltSnap]

No. I don't think new tech divers should be dealing with narcosis and CO2 on top of already being task loaded with new skills during a course.
I believe if you can't get a suitable gas for a dive, then you don't make that dive. That line may get blurred later with a lot of experience to back up the skills, but not when they are new to everything and taking their first technical course.

So poor folks in third world countries should just not get into technical diving EVEN when agency standards allow for such training?

 

[211ratsbud]

So poor folks in third world countries should just not get into technical diving EVEN when agency standards allow for such training?

It's like you are trying to put words in his mouth. Every thing he said has been clearly from his point of view.

I don't know Tracy, but i don't think he's the right instructor for you.

 

[BoltSnap]

I don't know Tracy, but i don't think he's the right instructor for you.

I am not/wasn't looking for an instructor. I was questioning his line of thinking and reasoning.

It's like you are trying to put words in his mouth. Every thing he said has been clearly from his point of view.

I was quoting his own words.

 

[SpeedyJ]

So poor folks in third world countries should just not get into technical diving EVEN when agency standards allow for such training?

Why do you draw the line at 45m? Flip to another agency and you can get training diving air to 73m… great for the third world! Or is that too deep when agency standards allow it?

Just because an agency says something is allowed doesn’t mean that as individuals we have to adopt that standard in our personal diving.

 

[211ratsbud]

So poor folks in third world countries should just not get into technical diving EVEN when agency standards allow for such training?

Sorry I didn't recall reading anything about poor folks in third world countries. I also didn't see where that was a reasonable conclusion to his line of thinking.

Like most things, it comes down to the instructor you select. I only teach ANDP with helitrox and I don't teach air dil deco. I don't believe in either, so they can find another instructor if that is what they want.

I thought this was fairly clear. He's addressing his beliefs here succinctly.

If you're not familiar with the ladder advanced nitrox can be taught with decompression procedures or Helitrox. He is refraining from teaching the course without helium.

 

[Tracy]

So poor folks in third world countries should just not get into technical diving EVEN when agency standards allow for such training?

No, I didn't say they shouldn't get into it. I said they shouldn't seek me out to teach it for them.
Agency standards are minimum standards. My standards are not.

 

[L13]

There is a big difference between prices in Europe and in the US or Mexico. Here it is between 1000 and 1200 euro for the mod1 (air diluent with deco). TDI or IANTD and sometimes IART.
Also cave diving courses are here less exepensive than in Mexico. And it is not that the courses here are bad. So if you pay 300 per day, maybe also look for the price of a ticket to come to Europe and do a course here.
I will never pay 300 for a day, I simply had and have not the money for that. If I will ask 300 for a day training, nobody will do a course with me anymore. And if I had to pay such prices, I would have been self trained.
So prices are really depending on region.

Interesting!

Average cost of labor US: ~$40/hr
Average cost of labor EU: ~$30/hr
Average cost of labor MX: ~$5/hr

Cost of RB Instructor US: ~$300/day
Cost of RB Instructor EU: ~$200/day
Cost of RB Instructor MX: ~$300/day

I wonder why the EU values RB Instruction so much less.

 

[Alekseolsen]

If like to know if there's a difference between how much of the daily rates the instructor "brings home" between Euorope and Americas. Could it be that the "insurance-package" in the Americas eats away at the profit? (Obviously taxes does the same, likely more in Europe than US).

My point is, would you as an Entrepreneur have to have higher rates in the Americas than Europe to have the same lifestyle?

I also don't think most of Europe's cace/tech divespots have too much tourist-impact on the prices compared to divespots in MX.