Testing a strange buddy

[Doc Intrepid]

So as not to hijack the other thread, I would like to get techniques for evaluating a buddy hookup on a dive boat. I will be diving in Mexico early next year and will not have a buddy with me. The dive charter company assures me they will get me a buddy, but how do you judge the competence of a put together buddy? Under what circumstances would you pass on the dive?

Just remember that in Coz you are responsible for you, not the DM nor anyone else. There are a number of horror stories on this board (do a search under "horror" ) about such adventures as "guided swim-throughs" led by DMs taking people through basically overhead environments at 110' (who were low on gas to start with, afraid of the dark, someone ahead of them swimming slowly through the tunnel so they were now boxed in behind and having difficulties, and other bozonity). Related clusters include "lets figure out navigation", "fun with high currents", and "whats my SPG for?", each of which features interesting opportunities for lessons-learned involving the inept and the incompetent mingling with the anxious and the confused. To a large extent most of these adventures involved "trust me" dives where the DM enthusiastically plunges into the abyss shouting "pools open" while a motley assortment of chaos, overweighted inexperience, and detached pieces follows with varying degrees of dismay. Tales abound of individuals thinking "hmmm, this is not good" in a position where they either follow the ball o' doom receding in the distance after the DM (entering the long swim-thru tunnel, etc.) or follow their instinct - which is to surface because they've hit their gas limit.

Remember that you plan your dive. You dive your plan. Tell the DM what you're planning or doing, certainly, but don't do something against your better judgement because the DM is happily escorting the circus into some SNAFU-rich environment.

Bon Voyage!

Doc

 

[Charlie99]

If you are going to Coz...no worries.Hook up with the DM if you want a buddy.You get a better tour that way anyway.

In the typical group dive led by the DM, the DM will NOT be your buddy in that he will NOT ascend with you if you use up air faster than others in the group. There have been a few incident reports posted where a diver mistakenly thought the DM was his buddy, when in fact he was not.

 

[Charlie99]

I travel solo on virtually all of my dive trips.

Some random comments on coping:

1. Boat dives with DM and "loose buddy" groups work well because I have good enough air consumption to not have to go up early. For someone with not so good of air consumption rate, the "loose buddy" system (no formally assigned buddies for solo travelers. You just dive as a big group) can easily result in you doing a solo ascent. Hooking up with a buddy beforehand is a better idea.

2. Check out the other divers on the boat. Usually you can pretty easily pick out the existing buddy pairs and groups. Strike up a conversation with other "unattached" divers. Just some general chit chat about the dive sites, how long you have been diving, and what sort of diving (fish nerd, photog, etc) you like will often very quickly tell you whether or not another diver is a good match for you.

3. If someone is flaky, nervous, or arrogant topside, those attributes will probably show up underwater too. Go with your hunches and hook up with someone else if you have "bad vibes" about a diver. I've usually regretted it when I've ignored my hunches about someone. Personality or attitude on the boat has been, by far, the best indicator of the quality of a buddy.

4. Joining an existing buddy pair as a third diver is more likely to cause problems than forming a new buddy pair. Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for an existing buddy pair to pretty much ignore another diver that has been forced upon them by the boat or DM. Be very cautious in this sort of situation and make sure that you have willing buddies with positive attitudes.

5. Make sure that you do a thorough predive briefing, above and beyond whatever site briefing you may get from the boat. All the usual stuff. Intended profiles. Who leads. What sort of swimming speed/dive pace. Air pressure and time turnpoints. The general route intended. What sort of "formation" are you going to dive in (follow the leader single file; abreast; 1 leader followed by 2 buddies trailing, etc -- obviously, for 2 people, abreast makes life much easier). General range for buddy-to-buddy distance. Make sure that you are all in agreement on basic stuff such as lost diver procedures, and solo descents/ascents / aborts vs. all divers staying together at all times as a buddy group (The wisdom or one method vs. another is for another thread. My point here is that you need to have reached prior agreement before starting the dive).

6. I find it convenient to know my buddy's air starting air pressure, and then to compare SPGs fairly early in the dive. That first comparison will generally show who will be the limiting factor on air, and give me a general idea on how their pressure relates to what my SPG is going to be reading.

7. Be open and honest with others about your experience, capabilities, limitations, and concerns. Expect the same from them. One of my basic rules is "no surprises".

8. Debrief after the dive. Tell your buddy how it went from your perspective. Ask your buddies for comments on how they would like to change things for the next dive. If something bugs you, fix it or change buddies. If you are the more experienced person, and led the first dive, consider having the other person lead the 2nd dive.

 

[serambin]

I travel solo on virtually all of my dive trips.

Some random comments on coping:

1. Boat dives with DM and "loose buddy" groups work well because I have good enough air consumption to not have to go up early. For someone with not so good of air consumption rate, the "loose buddy" system (no formally assigned buddies for solo travelers. You just dive as a big group) can easily result in you doing a solo ascent. . .

Well thought out and great ideas. I actually made a check list from your post.

. . . I new with that much experience, you must know something . . .

 

[boulderjohn]

I, too, wallk onto many a boat unsure who my buddy will be, and I, too, have done it often in Cozumel.

Some of the more elaborate responses are really excellent in ideal conditions, and I would say that I have usually not had much of a problem at all. The exceptions are when there aren't many people on the boat, and you don't have a lot of options. Then you get what you get.

Fortunately, in Cozumel, as you have been told, you usually dive in a group, and you are close enough to everyone else that your buddy is not that big an issue, unless....

Last year I was on a dive in which the dive operator made an attempt to put people with similar skills together, and they got it 75% correct. There was a couple, another guy, and I. The couple and I were professionals. The other guy was on his first trip after certifying.

Guess who my buddy was?

As you might have guessed, he was low on air when the rest of us were just getting started. He needed a buddy for his ascent, so up I went. I kept my eye on the rest of the group as we ascended and as we did our surface interval. At the surface, I saw the boat in the near distance, gave him my safety sausage, and was able to rejoin the group. I did the same thing on the second dive, although with some advanced planning.

By the way, the dive op gave me my money back for that trip.

So my advice to you is this. Don't worry as much about your buddy as your dive op. The next time I go to Coz, I am going to step on the boat of an operator I think is going to make sure that doesn't happen. I am not sure which one it will be, but I have a few good choices in mind.

 

[Charlie99]

There was a couple, another guy, and I. The couple and I were professionals. The other guy was on his first trip after certifying.

Guess who my buddy was?
.......
So my advice to you is this. Don't worry as much about your buddy as your dive op. The next time I go to Coz, I am going to step on the boat of an operator I think is going to make sure that doesn't happen.

What should the operator have done? (I'll later post what Dive with Martin did).

 

[Diver0001]

When scanning the boat for an instabuddy I look for someone who handles themself and their gear with confidence, someone who asks me some smart questions before i start asking them and someone whose goals for the dive more or less match mine.

In addition:

Same ocean same day buddies are useless, I'd rather dive solo so it's clear to all. If someone suggests something like splitting up under water I'll say "let's just split up now and get it over with...." That puts the root of the issue on the table and it's usually cleared up one way or the other straight away.

I don't mind inexperienced buddies as long as they're approaching their diving with intellegence and/or don't try to conceal their inexperience.

I want to hear the word "we" 5 times more often than the word "I" when we're doing the dive planning.

I look for a social click. If it clicks top side then there's a better chance that it will click in the water.

I probably missed a bunch of stuff but that's a start.

R..

 

[Cudabait]

I try to keep it real simple......I usually chat casually with a potential dive buddy and if I feel the chemistry is promising, I'll just ask them what things they like to expect from their dive buddy. I listen and if I like what they say I've got a dive buddy. If not, they don't.

Also, about rebreathers......No doubt, they will be the thing in sport diving. I don't know any rebreather divers (inspirational) that did not begin on OC equipment. They know how to use a buddy's octo, etc. in an OOA emergency, or any of several other UW emergency situations. I personally do not like to buddy with a rebreather diver unless he is wearing a pony bottle and redundant reg. The reason is simple....most OC divers probably don't realize that the rebreather diver cannot pass you his reg underwater without shutting the mouthpiece valve that prevents water from entering the rig. The OC diver would have to know how to open the valve, get gas, and then again, close the valve before passing the rig back again. Mucho task loading!

Simply, a rebreather operates like the old single hose, single stage regulator in that the gas flow is one way....comes in one side, is breathed and goes out the other through non-return valve. If water gets in the mouthpiece and goes downstream, it defeats the function of the rebreather. The system is designed to scrub and recirculate gas, not water.

Most sport divers are taught to dive OC and to rely on other OC equipment divers as buddy's. It would seem to do otherwise would be beyond the scope and level of their training.

If not already somewhere else on the board, maybe bigjetdriver could comment on the practicality of rebreather and OC divers buddying up. He is truly an expert!!

I only commented because it was brought up in this thread. Forgive if it's my bad.

Regards,

 

[wedivebc]

I try to keep it real simple......I usually chat casually with a potential dive buddy and if I feel the chemistry is promising, I'll just ask them what things they like to expect from their dive buddy. I listen and if I like what they say I've got a dive buddy. If not, they don't.

Also, about rebreathers......No doubt, they will be the thing in sport diving. I don't know any rebreather divers (inspirational) that did not begin on OC equipment. They know how to use a buddy's octo, etc. in an OOA emergency, or any of several other UW emergency situations. I personally do not like to buddy with a rebreather diver unless he is wearing a pony bottle and redundant reg. The reason is simple....most OC divers probably don't realize that the rebreather diver cannot pass you his reg underwater without shutting the mouthpiece valve that prevents water from entering the rig. The OC diver would have to know how to open the valve, get gas, and then again, close the valve before passing the rig back again. Mucho task loading!

Simply, a rebreather operates like the old single hose, single stage regulator in that the gas flow is one way....comes in one side, is breathed and goes out the other through non-return valve. If water gets in the mouthpiece and goes downstream, it defeats the function of the rebreather. The system is designed to scrub and recirculate gas, not water.

Most sport divers are taught to dive OC and to rely on other OC equipment divers as buddy's. It would seem to do otherwise would be beyond the scope and level of their training.

If not already somewhere else on the board, maybe bigjetdriver could comment on the practicality of rebreather and OC divers buddying up. He is truly an expert!!

I only commented because it was brought up in this thread. Forgive if it's my bad.

Regards,

I'm no BigJetDriver but I would like to comment. I don't know any rebreather diver who doesn't carry some form of open circuit bailout. I agree with you about having the slung OC bottle but after this thread started I actually went to my regular OC buddy and gave her a thorough run down on bailout options, which essentially call for her to breath off my air2 which always has at very least 10cuft or air available. Buddy breathing using rebreather hose is very impractical although still taught by some rebreather instructors is not going to be used by OC divers.

 

[Mo2vation]

Also, about rebreathers......No doubt, they will be the thing in sport diving.

And Highball will be in the Olympics

And the Internet will Kill Best Buy

And ScubaStop.com will show us a thing or two, by golly

And the Electric Car will sweep the nation

And the DVD will be the end of movie theatres

And the...

And the...

New Math

New economy

O2 bars...

Pet rocks...

* yawn *

Wake me when rebreathers become "the thing" in sport diving.

---
Ken