Touching Female Cave Students By Consent: An Instructor's Perspective

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

oya

Rebreather Pilot
Scuba Instructor
Messages
490
Reaction score
1,037
Location
Akumal, MX
# of dives
5000 - ∞
One in four women have experienced sexual assault to some degree in their lives. This is not to suggest that every fourth woman that you meet has been violently raped at knifepoint - but, statistically, you probably do know someone who has. Just because someone hasn't had a knife to their throat doesn't discount an experience of sexual assault or abuse. And of course, men are victims of sexual abuse/assault as well, albeit not at the same statistical rate.

This is something that always sits in the back of my head when I, a large man, am working with students. Especially female students, who tend to be a lot smaller-statured than me.

Diving is not an elegant sport - we all know that. As soon as your mask comes off it exposes the fact that your entire face is covered in snot. Divers tend to be perfectly honest about how they urinate all over themselves when wearing a wetsuit. There is - shall we say? - an intimacy to diving, even among strangers.

As a dive professional one is in the position, with a general expectation by all, to poke and prod and yank and guide and tighten and loosen equipment and generally manhandle people. There are classes, like DPV, where there are skills where you hold onto someone’s crotch-strap right between their legs.

As an instructor working with someone to get their gear configured, especially something extra fussy like a sidemount harness, there is a great deal of poking and prodding and tugging on this bungee to try to get just the right tension, and taking up an extra centimetre of material here or there. I’m often putting my hands in places that would get someone arrested in other circumstances or suggest the context of at least a second or third date.

To that end: I always start such a class with the question of whether people are extra protective of their personal space. I am always very clear, beforehand, about where my hands are going to be and why. Before a dive when I may be making adjustments I try to explain, “All you need to do is tell me stop and the adjustments are done then and there,” to make sure people know they have an “escape hatch” if they feel vulnerable for whatever reason. On the surface, when I can, if I am going to be working anywhere near… you know… no-no zones I say what I would like to do and ask if that is OK?

I bring up my own reluctance to have my personal space imposed upon. I don’t like to be touched, generally. Not what you would call a hugger. I use that as the foundation for the explanation that any contact that makes you uncomfortable ends. I figure using my own eccentricity as the model is a hell of a lot less imposing than “Do you have a history of abuse that makes strangers touching you emotionally and/or physically painful?"

“Is it OK if I tug on your butt-d-ring?” seems like very little effort to ensure a student’s comfort. And that’s my job: to help people build the skills and confidence to do what they want to as divers, to ensure their safety and their perception of safety above and below the water. It is not my job to cop a feel and ruin someone’s experience with diving and dive instructors forever.

“Does anyone ever say no?” asked a student once, laughingly.

"No", I admitted. No one ever has. But they might.

And I always want to make sure that I’ve established a relationship where they feel safe in the knowledge that if they ask me to stop tinkering with whatever I’m tinkering with, I will. Right away. No questions asked. That feels important to me.

I can not even imagine feeling that vulnerable, with that difference in the power dynamic of student and teacher, feeling taken advantage of in some way, feeling you need to push through something that hard and/or triggering because you think you are supposed to, or ignored or unheard when you want to cry out. Can’t hardly imagine that would be a terribly enjoyable class, nor do much for a person’s enthusiasm for the sport.

I’ve known dive instructors over the years who feel like a little leer or a little grope, their eyes or their fingers always lingering a little too long, from time to time is one of the perks of the job. I’ve heard DMs bragging about it. I’ve heard people who were just trying to enjoy their vacation complaining about it. I’ve heard shop owners bury it; just as often as not it was the shop owner what done it.

I can’t stress this enough: f**k those people. (Incidentally, if it’s someone you suspect I know even passingly now… no. I do not currently know any douchebag who thinks that way. Thank god.)

As I was talking to the student who had asked whether anyone had ever preferred that I not touch them another instructor happened by. A widely experienced and deservedly well-respected instructor and instructor-trainer; a woman. I asked her into the conversation of consent and whether she always asked.

After a brief pause to think about it she explained, “No. I don’t ask. I tell people there will be groping as a warning, but I don’t really ask. But I’m a girl.”

After a bit more discussion, we agreed that they dynamic for a female instructor vs. a male one - for better or worse - is different. She agreed that for an instructor class she would, indeed, explain to her instructor candidates that asking is best-practice anyway.

I like being in an area where the level of professionalism is as high as it generally is; working around so many people who think carefully about these sorts of things. It’s a hell of a relief over being in the sort of area where a woman showing up for a DSD in a bikini sets the whole crew atwitter with who is going to get to hold onto her BCD’s shoulder strap for the whole dive.

What are your thoughts, readers? Whatever your life experience, have you ever felt uncomfortable being poked and prodded in a class environment, or having co-students get too up close and personal during DPV or blindfolded (touch-contact) air-share drills? Did you feel reluctant or even unable to articulate your discomfort? Or do you lean the other way and find repetitive, "Is this OK" questions from your instructor to be overly conservative or even downright annoying? Please share your perspectives, if you feel comfortable so doing, because in addition to wanting to make my class environment better, I feel this is a dialogue that's very valuable in its own right: instructors, students, men, women, non-binary, whatever. We're all divers, and all in this together.
 
It just happened that both my cave instructors were women. But I’ve had male instructors for other classes and they always asked before adjusting gear, etc. Both women cave instructors (one was also my CCR instructor) always asked, as well.

None of the men I ever had for instructors were dicks. If anyone had gotten inappropriate, I’d have ripped them a good one and slapped them if necessary (I’ve had to do this with other men who’ve gotten handsy in the past).
 
“Does anyone ever say no?” asked a student once, laughingly.

"No", I admitted. No one ever has. But they might.
This quote here ^^^^ might give your students a false sense their inability to say no. Given the history of no one ever saying "no" or "that's enough" they may feel they shouldn't be or can't be the first. If asked, it does no harm (imo) to say that a past student has asked to not have certain adjustments made.

I taught male and female Marines hand to hand combat skills (MCMAP) and before any class or specific maneuver, I'd explain the process and verify they were ok with it. More often than not I had male Marines to be my meat puppets, but that wasn't always an option for the students. If the student wasn't ok with it then I worked to get another female in the course to be their partner.
 
I know my instructor training included a discussion of this. I also know instructors who were "fired" for such inappropriate actions, though I don't know if the agency revoked their credentials.

For my part, I tend not so much to ask permission as to tell them "here's what I'm going to be doing" so it's clear up-front before I, e.g., grab a students harness during a CESA.

But beyond the "harness grab" there are limited times I touch a student or their gear. Off the top of my head, here's where it's going to happen:

1. For students with contact lenses, I hold their wrist while doing a no-mask underwater swim. (Except for a DM candidate, who I made do it without guidance since they'd have to demonstrate it.) I let them know ahead of time of course.

2. For shared-air, students grab each others arms or I grab a students arm and put their hand on my arm. Again, I let them know ahead of time what's happening. That said, I recently worked with an instructor who had students grab the harness instead. Not sure that's less invasive or not, but I'm thinking of using it as a better practice.

3. Loose tank band: I often use students as the "victim" for each other. I then loosen the band. Again, this is notified in advance.

4. Tired diver tows, of course.

Obviously, a Rescue Diver course gets much more "handsy" for obvious reasons.

I can think of only a couple of times I was concerned about my "inappropriate touching." One time I had a student doing the guided no-mask swim who was a bit more nervous (as I found out) than others about the skills. She grabbed my hand and yanked it dangerously close to parts I really didn't want to be that close to, and up against her, uh, "upper chest." It was a serious death grip on my hand. The other situations tend to be the odd minor emergency situation, e.g., a student loses buoyancy control and you're intervening. Not much you can do but grab a leg in some instances and hold them down. In hindsight, I might let students know in advance that that's going to happen.

Then there's the odd time a student is repeatedly kicking me, not realizing they're right on top of me. I tend to shove them away with whichever body part is closest to my face.....
 
*** FOR THE RECORD ***

The language of this post is not my own. It has been edited (probably for the better) from the original.

My thanks to whichever moderator took the time to parse this all out and make it presentable on Scubaboard.

And my thanks to all who have thoughts to, hopefully progressively, add to this conversation.

Safe diving, All.
 
I’ve known dive instructors over the years who feel like a little leer or a little grope, their eyes or their fingers always lingering a little too long, from time to time is one of the perks of the job. I’ve heard DMs bragging about it. I’ve heard people who were just trying to enjoy their vacation complaining about it. I’ve heard shop owners bury it; just as often as not it was the shop owner what done it.
I hope that someone has a camera ready for anyone who tries that with my daughter, as she will learn MMA, how to shoot from a Marine combat veteran/military contractor trainer, etc.. She has the same fire as her mother.
 
I hope that someone has a camera ready for anyone who tries that with my daughter, as she will learn MMA, how to shoot from a Marine combat veteran/military contractor trainer, etc.. She has the same fire as her mother.
These Dive shops mentioned in your quoted comment need to be named so they can be avoided and reported.
 
Caveat: I will never be a cave student.
As to touching in general, if I am paying an instructor and as part of that training they feel things need to be adjusted, I am fine with a verbal heads up and a touch.
In a class, with an Instructor I have chosen, where I am looking to learn things.
What I am sick of is boat crew reaching for buckles before I have even taken a breath. Keep your f’ing hands to yourself. If the guy over there doesn’t seem to need help with his crotch strap why assume I do?
 
From my perspective, There’s touching because you need to adjust something on me and there’s linging just a bit too long and im going to ask you to pay for it. I have been assaulted (by a dental surgeon- reported) and i have had an instructor or buddy have to get a bit Personal, but we both knew it had to happen. Not a big deal. Consent vs No consent.

Edit to add i taught for a lot of years. Male or female i always talked thru where my hands need to go (buckle, belt etc) and i did adjust the majority of teens and females when co teaching with a man.
 
“Does anyone ever say no?” asked a student once, laughingly.

"No", I admitted. No one ever has. But they might.

I think it is logical that someone who is uncomfortable with being touched may also be uncomfortable making a public statement about that, particularly in a group where their peers are not opting-out.

This quote here ^^^^ might give your students a false sense their inability to say no. Given the history of no one ever saying "no" or "that's enough" they may feel they shouldn't be or can't be the first. If asked, it does no harm (imo) to say that a past student has asked to not have certain adjustments made.

I taught male and female Marines hand to hand combat skills (MCMAP) and before any class or specific maneuver, I'd explain the process and verify they were ok with it. More often than not I had male Marines to be my meat puppets, but that wasn't always an option for the students. If the student wasn't ok with it then I worked to get another female in the course to be their partner.

I do a lot of yoga, possibly the furthest thing from hand-to-hand combat. :)

Many instructors will offer hands-on assists/adjustments. Sometimes that is very personal touching.

Now, virtually every instructor notifies the students in advance and allows people to opt-out.

Good instructors allow people to opt-out "anonymously", without letting the rest of the class know their preference. This doesn't need to be a formal thing. For example, early in a class, while students have their eyes closed or are lying face down, the instructor may say that anyone who does not want to be touched should put their hand palm-up, or move their foot off the edge or their yoga mat, etc. This action is visible to the instructor only.

A similar technique would probably be very helpful in getting consent (or allowing people to opt-out) from being touched during SCUBA instruction. Perhaps ask students to float face-down in the pool (snorkeling) and raise one hand above the water to signify that they do not want to be touched.
 

Back
Top Bottom