Unauthorized Sellers of Scubapro, Apeks and NO WARRANTY for you baby!
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cybordolphin
Guest
Your kinda a lil bit of an arss aren't ya..... that or a major troll.
Or both.... hahahahahaahahahahaaahaha (neat word). Hmmm maybe the wife of a LDS owner.
That's ok. I love watching persons like yourself get all frustrated at the world.
Online buying is here to stay bud..... and in the next few years, you will see the Apek's out there rethink their strategies. They will be forced to. They will be making 80% plus of their revenue from the online monsters (I think that is what you and your kind want to call them?).
I personally will not turn over my equipment to be serviced (or anything else I own), to a desperate, in need of help, failing local businessowner. That is just asking for trouble.
The "Sport Chalet's" of the country will survive.... the rest....
well unless they get a real quick education on computer use.... are already one foot in the abyss. In the meantime.... the death of LDS will bring about some ugly tactics, and humilations galore. Do I feel bad for the LDS..... yep. Am I going to pay 3x $$ for my products from them..... nope. Am I worried that I won't be able to find air or have my equipment serviced? Nope. Please. The manufacturers and the powers that be, driving the dive industry will never let that happen. THEY have too much at stake. They just don't want it to be TOO obvious they have a hand on the gun being placed in the back of the head of the LDS.
In the meantime... the consumer's if need be will do the inevitable. I know for instance that some have purchased a reg online, then turned around and purchased a reg from a local retailer (that has a good return policy) and simply return the online purchased reg in place of the local store bought one... just to be sure they are getting that warranty. Unethical? Not any more than a manufacturer refusing to service its own product under any/all circumstances. Or a LDS using scare tactics to stay afloat.
JMO (that's "J" as in "Just".... "M" as in "My"... "O" as in "Opinion".
(no I am sure of it... you are not a troll)
Or both.... hahahahahaahahahahaaahaha (neat word). Hmmm maybe the wife of a LDS owner.
That's ok. I love watching persons like yourself get all frustrated at the world.
Online buying is here to stay bud..... and in the next few years, you will see the Apek's out there rethink their strategies. They will be forced to. They will be making 80% plus of their revenue from the online monsters (I think that is what you and your kind want to call them?).
I personally will not turn over my equipment to be serviced (or anything else I own), to a desperate, in need of help, failing local businessowner. That is just asking for trouble.
The "Sport Chalet's" of the country will survive.... the rest....
well unless they get a real quick education on computer use.... are already one foot in the abyss. In the meantime.... the death of LDS will bring about some ugly tactics, and humilations galore. Do I feel bad for the LDS..... yep. Am I going to pay 3x $$ for my products from them..... nope. Am I worried that I won't be able to find air or have my equipment serviced? Nope. Please. The manufacturers and the powers that be, driving the dive industry will never let that happen. THEY have too much at stake. They just don't want it to be TOO obvious they have a hand on the gun being placed in the back of the head of the LDS.
In the meantime... the consumer's if need be will do the inevitable. I know for instance that some have purchased a reg online, then turned around and purchased a reg from a local retailer (that has a good return policy) and simply return the online purchased reg in place of the local store bought one... just to be sure they are getting that warranty. Unethical? Not any more than a manufacturer refusing to service its own product under any/all circumstances. Or a LDS using scare tactics to stay afloat.
JMO (that's "J" as in "Just".... "M" as in "My"... "O" as in "Opinion".
(no I am sure of it... you are not a troll)
You got it all wrong JM AH-O-LE, I'm not frustrated at the world, it seems that you are. I didn't know that trolls dove, hahahha. You must scull a lot, or do you just got webbed feet, ahahahha.
Anyway, I got the answer I needed from this board, I can go either way, LDS or On-line. I've done both, and I'm happy with both. Woohahaha.
Anyway, I got the answer I needed from this board, I can go either way, LDS or On-line. I've done both, and I'm happy with both. Woohahaha.
I don't know where any of these unauthorised dealers get their regs, or parts for that matter. Scubapro has a policy that you DO NOT DISCOUNT their gear, or risk loss of dealership. I've seen this threatened personally, and it pisses me off. When asked why we had to sell at MRSPs when any one can get brand new gear on ebay for 200 bux cheaper they just shrugged their shoulders and went right on threatening.
So here is the SP dealer trying to make a living, caught between a rock (SP rep) and a hard place (customers seeing online prices substantially cheaper than they are allowed to sell). I tend to feel for the shop owner. His only recourse is to make sure you have your registration card when you bring in your reg for service. After all, you paid big bux for a reg that comes with lifetime parts. SP makes it worth the dive shop's while by sending them free parts to work on the regs. This way all the required parts can be used to service the reg properly.
If I wasn't making that extra 200 bux on the reg, and I couldn't get parts free through SPs free parts program, do you REALLY TRULY think I would put all new parts in when you send it back for service? NOT. If you think they will, you would be living in some wet dream world.
One customer brought two sets of regs in for servicing complaining that they were just recently serviced, but the Air IIs were leaking and the gauges weren't working. This was on a Mk 2 / 190 combo i believe. The gauge thing was a no brainer, so I originally thought, till I took the gauges off and put another set (which I knew worked) on. The needle didn't budge when the air was turned on, yet the 2nd stage regs seemed to work fine. No air was getting into the gauges. I disassembled the yoke and found an EXTRA oring blocking the air to the HP port. I then rebuilt the regs and found that the AIR IIs both had the seats turned around backwards, AND 2 extra orings in each one.
This guy was on his vacation when he found out these regs weren't repaired properly. As it turned out, the guy that serviced them was NOT a SP dealer. I gave him the extra orings and didn't charge him for the 1st stage rebuild on the promise he send the extra parts back to the tech and tell him from me to put them in the regs they are supposed to be in.
By the way, if he had to rent regs for the week he was on vacation, that 200 bux would have been an expensive savings.
So here is the SP dealer trying to make a living, caught between a rock (SP rep) and a hard place (customers seeing online prices substantially cheaper than they are allowed to sell). I tend to feel for the shop owner. His only recourse is to make sure you have your registration card when you bring in your reg for service. After all, you paid big bux for a reg that comes with lifetime parts. SP makes it worth the dive shop's while by sending them free parts to work on the regs. This way all the required parts can be used to service the reg properly.
If I wasn't making that extra 200 bux on the reg, and I couldn't get parts free through SPs free parts program, do you REALLY TRULY think I would put all new parts in when you send it back for service? NOT. If you think they will, you would be living in some wet dream world.
One customer brought two sets of regs in for servicing complaining that they were just recently serviced, but the Air IIs were leaking and the gauges weren't working. This was on a Mk 2 / 190 combo i believe. The gauge thing was a no brainer, so I originally thought, till I took the gauges off and put another set (which I knew worked) on. The needle didn't budge when the air was turned on, yet the 2nd stage regs seemed to work fine. No air was getting into the gauges. I disassembled the yoke and found an EXTRA oring blocking the air to the HP port. I then rebuilt the regs and found that the AIR IIs both had the seats turned around backwards, AND 2 extra orings in each one.
This guy was on his vacation when he found out these regs weren't repaired properly. As it turned out, the guy that serviced them was NOT a SP dealer. I gave him the extra orings and didn't charge him for the 1st stage rebuild on the promise he send the extra parts back to the tech and tell him from me to put them in the regs they are supposed to be in.
By the way, if he had to rent regs for the week he was on vacation, that 200 bux would have been an expensive savings.
R
redacted
Guest
I believe we may be confusing the manufacturer and the distributer. It appears to me that the No Discount policy is a feature of Scubapro USA (which includes Canada) but not the manufacturers of the Scubapro line or other distributers like Scubapro Spain.
Also, it appears that the "parts for life" feature of the warrenty is another Scubapro USA offering that is not the international Scubapro standard. Thus it is understandable that US dealers associated with Scubapro USA would not provide parts for life service for regulators acquired from Diveinn, for example. That they chose to label them 'grey market' is unfortunate.
For me, I chose the savings over the service. Especially when parts for the Mk25/S600 cost under $20.00 from Diveinn and should last 3 years or more with good care. The annual service requirement to maintain warrenty (appears to be a Scubapro wide requirement) is, IMO, another deceptive ripoff.
If I EVER hear gruff from a LDS about servicing my hardware, I will simply service my own.
I can buy the overhaul kits from DiveInn and other sources.
I have ordered the Regulator Service book, which includes specific breakdowns of a LOT of different makes and models of regulators, from Airspeed press.
Yes, I understand this isn't for everyone. And further, since its my arse, I won't service someone ELSE's regulator for them. But, if I feel qualified to service MY OWN Life support hardware, I will.
There's no "black art" about this stuff. It is, in fact, science.
I can buy the overhaul kits from DiveInn and other sources.
I have ordered the Regulator Service book, which includes specific breakdowns of a LOT of different makes and models of regulators, from Airspeed press.
Yes, I understand this isn't for everyone. And further, since its my arse, I won't service someone ELSE's regulator for them. But, if I feel qualified to service MY OWN Life support hardware, I will.
There's no "black art" about this stuff. It is, in fact, science.
Personally, I prefer working on my own regulators as well. Getting parts kits can be tricky. Specially Poseidon kits. Diveinn seems to have them one day then not the next. So grab them when you can.
If you need the special tools to work on the regs try http://www.scubatools.com/ they make just about everything else you need to repair regulators.
Lots of the tools can be made easy enough.
If you need the special tools to work on the regs try http://www.scubatools.com/ they make just about everything else you need to repair regulators.
Lots of the tools can be made easy enough.
erichK
Contributor
Having re-certified come into diving in three different eras--the late sixties, the early eighties and again last year, and like some previous posters, also having some familiarity with such other sports as cycling, as well as such high tech hobbies as astronomy and photography gives me a bit of a perspective on this discussion.
First of all, divers are loaded down with ---likely too---many items of dive equipment Then there is a consistent pressure from certifying agencies, especially PADI, to make more and more equipment complulsory. Where once a reg, pressure guage, depth guage and a compass where pretty well all that was needed, enormously expensive BC's, seldom used auxillary regs, andf countless little doodads to attach and attach to these seem to have become the norm. Diver who seldom venture much below 40 or 50 feet are equipped with redundant guages to back up computers, small knives and flights to back up bigger ones,etc. This is not to mention safety sausages and other emergency items. Diving, like cycling or astronmy, is becoming a hobby in which one can easily spend the price of a car, simply trying to get merely close to the best of everything.
Yes, there are *possible* safety advantages to having all this equipment... but there are also real disdvantages to having to remember and hang onto it all, and especially to being festooned with so many hoses and straps and clips retractors and bits and pieces to fall out of pockets.
Then there is the squeeze that is produced by the combination of the fact that some, even much of this equipment is overpriced (especially as tagged or listed by the typical LDS) in combination with the indifferent equipment quality of and high rental prices the LDS charges for actual diving (as opposed to course equipment). The chance to get "deals" is real at the LDS, but it is also largely negated by the limited actual selection of actual equipment in stock at most LDS's
Having to equip a family of three (myself and my newly diving wife and daughter really alerted me to this situation. paying hundreds of dollars for mediocre and ill-fitting equipment, it became a choice between giving up diving or buying some decent and safe and comfortable gear. I 've finally managed to obtain new and near new dive computers, apeks and SP regs and BC's, etc, through E-bay and private purchases, plus a large number of smaller items (including Apeks and Air-2 auxillary regs) from Leisurepro for about halfof what the LDS would have charged.
To their credit, the LDS has been helpful, and even generous by giving some free minor service and safety checkover of equipment that I did not buy from them. They were also very good about letting me try items like masks and fins in the pool, before making final choices. However, in addition to rentals and air fills, we also did spend well over a thousand dollars Canadian on sets of fins, masks, snorkels, boots knives, horns and other odd pieces of gear.
We want to continue to have a good relationship with the LDS, however, as I've told the owner myself, if we are going to continue diving, then we will have to buy much of our gear from other sources.
erickK
P.S. Although things went fine with LeisurePro, I doubt that the principals involved are really divers. I have the impression that this operation is rerlated to the major camera store (Adorama), and is one of many such successful high volume Manhattan MO operations owned and run purely as a business.
Dive Inn (Scubastore) does seem to be more of a diving operation, and frankly I would have no hesitation ---and would probably prefer ---to buy from them.
ek
ek
First of all, divers are loaded down with ---likely too---many items of dive equipment Then there is a consistent pressure from certifying agencies, especially PADI, to make more and more equipment complulsory. Where once a reg, pressure guage, depth guage and a compass where pretty well all that was needed, enormously expensive BC's, seldom used auxillary regs, andf countless little doodads to attach and attach to these seem to have become the norm. Diver who seldom venture much below 40 or 50 feet are equipped with redundant guages to back up computers, small knives and flights to back up bigger ones,etc. This is not to mention safety sausages and other emergency items. Diving, like cycling or astronmy, is becoming a hobby in which one can easily spend the price of a car, simply trying to get merely close to the best of everything.
Yes, there are *possible* safety advantages to having all this equipment... but there are also real disdvantages to having to remember and hang onto it all, and especially to being festooned with so many hoses and straps and clips retractors and bits and pieces to fall out of pockets.
Then there is the squeeze that is produced by the combination of the fact that some, even much of this equipment is overpriced (especially as tagged or listed by the typical LDS) in combination with the indifferent equipment quality of and high rental prices the LDS charges for actual diving (as opposed to course equipment). The chance to get "deals" is real at the LDS, but it is also largely negated by the limited actual selection of actual equipment in stock at most LDS's
Having to equip a family of three (myself and my newly diving wife and daughter really alerted me to this situation. paying hundreds of dollars for mediocre and ill-fitting equipment, it became a choice between giving up diving or buying some decent and safe and comfortable gear. I 've finally managed to obtain new and near new dive computers, apeks and SP regs and BC's, etc, through E-bay and private purchases, plus a large number of smaller items (including Apeks and Air-2 auxillary regs) from Leisurepro for about halfof what the LDS would have charged.
To their credit, the LDS has been helpful, and even generous by giving some free minor service and safety checkover of equipment that I did not buy from them. They were also very good about letting me try items like masks and fins in the pool, before making final choices. However, in addition to rentals and air fills, we also did spend well over a thousand dollars Canadian on sets of fins, masks, snorkels, boots knives, horns and other odd pieces of gear.
We want to continue to have a good relationship with the LDS, however, as I've told the owner myself, if we are going to continue diving, then we will have to buy much of our gear from other sources.
erickK
P.S. Although things went fine with LeisurePro, I doubt that the principals involved are really divers. I have the impression that this operation is rerlated to the major camera store (Adorama), and is one of many such successful high volume Manhattan MO operations owned and run purely as a business.
Dive Inn (Scubastore) does seem to be more of a diving operation, and frankly I would have no hesitation ---and would probably prefer ---to buy from them.
ek
ek
if they discover "faulty"parts.. they would have to replace all regardless if they were authorized or not.. if a recall or product advisory is issued they have to comply regardless of source..
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