What to do when your buddy gets away

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I don't think I made it clear my intention fom this thread. I was not asking what I should have or should not have done in a particular situation. Nor was I asking how to avoid being in a particular situation. My intention was that we would discuss what would be the risks/benefits of different actions when a buddy begins to ascend or descend rapidly. That way we can have some information to make very quick decisions when faced with these situations.

This is in the new divers forum.

Rescue of someone in a runaway ascent or descent can be very dangerous to the rescuer and is not always successful. Don't attempt it without training. Prevention is perfectly safe and has a much better success rate. Focus on prevention at your current level (and indeed at every level) and then seek Rescue Diver training when you are ready for it.
 
It's not my intention to hijack this thread, but I have a practical question about checking weights in a new dive location. In August, me and my son will be diving in Cozumel for the first time. This will also be out first salt water dive. Assuming we don't get wet until we are above the reef, ready to dive, how do we properly determine the amount of weight needed for each of us?

Thanks!

Assuming your exposure suit is the same , add 5/6 pounds to your current weighting.

If it is not the same, you need to do a weight check and I would suggest you talk to the dive centre.
A weight check is the best way to be sure. There are guestimates but personally I'd rather ask the dive centre before you get in the water. (ie they might have a pool area where you can try on gear assuming you are renting their gear)

One thing I forgot ! For your first dive ask to do a shallow dive and use it as your checkout dive so that you are comfy with your gear and weighting. Have a word with the DM and explain that you'd like to check out your weighting. A good dive centre should be happy to help out.
 
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If your buddy begins a rapid ascent and you are close enough to get to them immediately- start by letting air out of their BC. If that doesn't work, let all air out or yours and see if together you are negative or neutral. ( The order can be switched) I am a firm believer that buddies should stay in touching distance most if not all the time, particularly with new divers. If you see your buddy in rapid ascent too far awayto assist without risking your own life all you can do is what you did. Then ascend at a safe rate. join them at the surface, and assist as circumstates dictate is necessary and possible. You are right to not engage in life threatening conduct to try and reach or restrain the ascending buddy. Stay close, have an awareness of each other, and practice buoyancy skills on every dive. Great question to raise.
DivemasterDennis
 
It's not my intention to hijack this thread, but I have a practical question about checking weights in a new dive location. In August, me and my son will be diving in Cozumel for the first time. This will also be out first salt water dive. Assuming we don't get wet until we are above the reef, ready to dive, how do we properly determine the amount of weight needed for each of us?
Thanks!
Find out if the dive center has a salt water pool they would be willing to let you work out your buoyancy in. That is exactly what I will be doing on my next trip to South Africa. They already said I could.
 
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OK Windapp, Here is what I have done in a particular run away descent & ascent.

Descent-
I was a Dive Master for an instructor who had a student who overweighted himself to make descending easier. The plan was to drop to 20 ft over a depth of about 90 ft & then swim along a wall to the shallow area of the quarry & then to a training platform. The instructor was at the head of the group & I was bringing up the rear. Once the student got to depth, his suit compressed & the weightbelt slipped off his hip & below his butt. AT that point he went into a passive panic & quit kicking, then started sinking. Seeing his distress I swam over quickly, but by the time I got to where he was, he was sinking very quickly. I went head first after him (my ears equalize very easily) & caught him by his cylinder valve at 70 ft. I was wearing a BC with a large lift capacity & just used my BC to start us to the surface, along with swimming both of us out. It was not a run away ascent, but we probably came up a little faster than we should have. I got the student situated & got him to the platform where the rest of the class was. I later informed the instructor what had transpired.

Ascent-
I was originally going to do a deep solo dive at the quarry to determine my air consumption under stressful conditions & at hard swimming pace. A friend wanting to do a deep dive asked if he could come along. He was deep trained, but in tropical conditions. I described my plan & objectives & he was agreeable. We talked a bit about what to do if there was a freeze- up free flow situation down there (water is 42 degrees at depth). We dropped down & leveled off at the planned depth (90ft). We gave each other the "OK" signal & I turned to begin my swim for the air consumption trial. Not even 10 seconds later, my buddy signals me with his rattle. I turn to see a little trickle of bubbles coming from his regulator. I knew what was coming (free flow) because the same thing happened to me about 8 mos earlier. I was in double cylinders & immediately offered him my long hose. The plan was to give him my air, turn his valve off, let his regulator thaw out & then re- energize it, give it back to him & then continue the dive. The buddy was frozen by fear, confusion & narcosis & would not take the long hose. About that time all hell broke loose & a total free flow ensued. He panicked & started bolting to the surface. I was just able to grab the bottom of his BC & was unable to get any higher to reach his inflator hose. As the air started expanding in his BC, we began to rise faster & faster. To help slow us down, I drained all the air from my BC to let my double cylinders act as drag. It work to some degree. Once we got to the surface & assured all was well, we discussed the situation. The diver now deep dives at the quarry with a redundant air source. In both cases, I did the best I could with the situations presented.

I hope that gives you a little of the answers that you're looking for. As was mentioned before prevention of these situations in the first place, is the best way to go.
 
It's not my intention to hijack this thread, but I have a practical question about checking weights in a new dive location. In August, me and my son will be diving in Cozumel for the first time. This will also be out first salt water dive. Assuming we don't get wet until we are above the reef, ready to dive, how do we properly determine the amount of weight needed for each of us?
@n733lk: For determining weighting needs on a Cozumel trip, the best approach is to conduct a proper weight check on a shore dive prior to doing any boat dives.

If this cannot be done, then I would recommend asking the boat op and DM if it would be possible to do a weight check while hanging off of the back of the boat prior to doing Dive #1. You need to ask about this ahead of time because your weight check will impact the plans of the DM-led group. On account of this situation, there will be a certain amount of time pressure placed on you and your son. Expect it and deal with it.

There is another option that could work if you know what kind of tanks you'll be using in Cozumel. FYI, most dive ops use AL80 tanks. Simply conduct a weight check in a local pool (fresh water) in all of the gear that you'll be using in Cozumel, including an AL80 tank. Then add enough weight to compensate for the greater density of salt water vs. fresh water. This is approx. 2.5% of your total weight (diver + diver's gear). For most people, this is works out to an additional 6-7 lbs.

If you can't do a weight check on-site in Cozumel prior to doing a boat dive, then it might be a good idea to take a couple extra lbs. as insurance against being too light at the end of the dive.

Please don't be that guy on the boat who gives a blank stare back to the DM when he asks: "How much weight do you need?" I've witnessed it several times on a Cozumel dive boat.
OK Windapp, Here is what I have done in a particular run away descent & ascent.

Descent-
I was a Dive Master for an instructor who had a student who overweighted himself to make descending easier. The plan was to drop to 20 ft over a depth of about 90 ft & then swim along a wall to the shallow area of the quarry & then to a training platform. The instructor was at the head of the group & I was bringing up the rear. Once the student got to depth, his suit compressed & the weightbelt slipped off his hip & below his butt. AT that point he went into a passive panic & quit kicking, then started sinking. Seeing his distress I swam over quickly, but by the time I got to where he was, he was sinking very quickly. I went head first after him (my ears equalize very easily) & caught him by his cylinder valve at 70 ft. I was wearing a BC with a large lift capacity & just used my BC to start us to the surface, along with swimming both of us out. It was not a run away ascent, but we probably came up a little faster than we should have. I got the student situated & got him to the platform where the rest of the class was. I later informed the instructor what had transpired.
@windapp: The rescue maneuver that tstormdiver describes above is something that might be appropriate for a DM to do. If you are a novice and have not received rescue training, you really have no business even attempting what she did. If you do what she did (use your own BCD's lift to slow down your buddy's descent) and accidentally let go of your buddy, both of you could be in a great deal of danger. The extra air inside your BCD is sure to lead to an uncontrolled ascent for you. Once you separate from your buddy, he'll be very negatively buoyant and he'll plummet downward. Hopefully, the descent was undertaken over a hard bottom.
 
@windapp: The rescue maneuver that tstormdiver describes above is something that might be appropriate for a DM to do. If you are a novice and have not received rescue training, you really have no business even attempting what she did. If you do what she did (use your own BCD's lift to slow down your buddy's descent) and accidentally let go of your buddy, both of you could be in a great deal of danger. The extra air inside your BCD is sure to lead to an uncontrolled ascent for you. Once you separate from your buddy, he'll be very negatively buoyant and he'll plummet downward. Hopefully, the descent was undertaken over a hard bottom.

Probably not the best method, but the best I could do in the situation. For sure there are multiple risks if I would have lost contact with the student. Thank you BT for pointing that out.

Windapp- Any rescue has its own set of risks, some more dangerous than others. If you are truly wanting to know what to do in some of these situations I could suggest a Rescue course of some sort. It will give you a gauge to determine those risks & whether they are worth it to you as a potential rescuer. Before you start, make sure your own skills are sharp & you are comfortable in your skills.
 
Thanks for the input everyone. Spoke with the Dive Op in Cozumel; they will give me a free shore dive to work out bouyancy prior to first reef trip.
 
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