White balance with canon 5d underwater video issue

[danvolker]

I have been doing all my white balancing in post, using the Cineform tool First Light....But I want to begin getting white balance through the camera....
I am assuming instead of the AWB setting I had used before, the Custom White balance proceedure is the way to go...I just watched a youtube video on this, and it is simple enough....
The question is ..how well will this work underwater? I use to large video cave lights, and as long as my subject is still, the custom WB should be good....but with all the Goliath Grouper aggregation and spawning video I plan on shooting in the next 2 weeks, everything will be moving often...my subjects AND me....Depth will be pretty constant at around 90 feet to 100 feet...some dives will be night dives ( which I am assuming will be easier to get perfect WB on....though even hear, with a wreck in the background, versus the sandy bottom, there will be different light casts to many sections of each clip....any suggestions?

Also....Should I plan on bringing a white towel down I can spread out on the bottom...something I could stuff in the storage pouch behind my halcyon backplate, out of the way till I need it? I can't paint my fins white
Thanks.



ps,,
Last year's spawning video I did...
Search for the Spawn...A Goliath Event - YouTube

 

[dhaas]

Dan,

White balancing for available light past 50' is a myth in my opinion even in the clearest water, mid-day sun penetration blah blah blah........

I've done the CUSTOM white balance on stills and video on my Canon SLRs and past 50' there just isn't enough warm reds or oranges left......

Here's a shot taken maybe at 20' after a quick white balance off my hand descending on a drift in Cozumel.

I'd use your lights

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

 

[danvolker]

Dan,

White balancing for available light past 50' is a myth in my opinion even in the clearest water, mid-day sun penetration blah blah blah........

I've done the CUSTOM white balance on stills and video on my Canon SLRs and past 50' there just isn't enough warm reds or oranges left......

Here's a shot taken maybe at 20' after a quick white balance off my hand descending on a drift in Cozumel.

I'd use your lights

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

In other words, do one custom white balance when I hit the bottom ( with lights on) and then dont worry about it...or use a Kelvin setting that looks good?

 

[dhaas]

Dan,

I've also tried adjusting the Kelvin setting but never had much success over simply doing a custom white balance when I change depth up or down 10' or so.

I'd maybe white balance as you pass 50' and THEN also add your lights.......

YMMV..........

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

 

[Ambassador Divers]

Guys

White balance is no myth beyond 50 ft. The Canon 5dMarkII will easily balance at 65ft. Beyond there it may take a few more tries, but it will do it. Here is a video out of one of my MarkIIs. The video starts at 80 ft. No adjustments were made in post.

Anchor Point « iDive Global Locations

---------- Post Merged at 09:53 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:49 PM ----------

My MarkIII is a low light monster and will balance at 80ft like the MarkII at 50ft.

 

[jdandvalerie]

Dan, check out my most recent goliath video over in the videography section. That is all custom WB and you know the sites...all greater than 65. Sun was strong overhead which is the only reason I switched from my usual stills over to video. Post was adding a little contrast and a slight curve adjustment. My personal preference has been custom WB when you have bright sunlight. If its overcast, you have to have lights to get any kind of decent color. The mg111 retained most of the color but the wreck trek footage i mainly used for wide shots with a ton of goliaths just for perspective.

I carry a white card, or as david said just use your palm. I wouldn't use a custom WB and then use your video lights as well...it would look like 2 red beams of light on your subject I would think.

 

[dhaas]

Dan and all,

Sounds like if you have a Canon 5d MKIII its low light abilities have pushed the envelope to more capability. Or even your 5D MK II (is that what you have Dan?)

JD and Ambassador; The white balancing using only available light past 50' or so and THEN adding in LED lights was from somewhere Ikelite recommended (can't recall where) so you'd have to try with your lights, your white balancing settings, etc.

My limited understanding of it is past 50' (or 70' or more?) there is very little red / orange for custom white balance to "see". Theory being adding daylight balanced lights AFTER you while balance (and are 2' or so away minimum) the combination can equal a nice "blend" of available light WB and artificial daylight.

Post processing with the latest greatest such as anon 5D MK III can likely also help tremendously.

I'm more a still shooter so others such as JD and Ambassador obviously have tried more........

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

 

[danvolker]

Dan and all,

Sounds like if you have a Canon 5d MKIII its low light abilities have pushed the envelope to more capability. Or even your 5D MK II (is that what you have Dan?)

JD and Ambassador; The white balancing using only available light past 50' or so and THEN adding in LED lights was from somewhere Ikelite recommended (can't recall where) so you'd have to try with your lights, your white balancing settings, etc.

My limited understanding of it is past 50' (or 70' or more?) there is very little red / orange for custom white balance to "see". Theory being adding daylight balanced lights AFTER you while balance (and are 2' or so away minimum) the combination can equal a nice "blend" of available light WB and artificial daylight.

Post processing with the latest greatest such as anon 5D MK III can likely also help tremendously.

I'm more a still shooter so others such as JD and Ambassador obviously have tried more........

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

I actually do have a fear about doing anything "new" on the night dive tonight, is being what is being predicted by our Marine Biologist specialist on Goliaths, as being "THE" night for the actual "Spawning"....I don't want to end up with nice whites and huge blown out reds from too much color shift.....I know there have been many times in post using Cineform First Light to white balance, that When I got a nice white in the background, areas my lights were hittting close to me were bright red and blown out--and should NOT be....

Maybe I will shoot tonight with the AWB on as usual ( which seems to do next to nothing) and just correct in Cineform. Depth on this night dive is 95 feet....moot on night dive anyway--no light except my big Apollo Video lights.

If I get plenty of something, maybe I will try a custom setting of the same, and then try a Kelvin....if there is time...I think a need for WB exists because the Apollo video lights do not create the perfect white on their own--they need to be corrected.
**according to the website:Apollo 50-watt HID systems offer exceptional light output (color temp: 6000 Kelvin, 3000 lumens)..Mine are dual head 50 watt

 

[jdandvalerie]

I agree, i wouldn't change anything. IMO the only way to film at night is with video lights...manual WB would not be of any use in the Mizpah or wreck trek (not sure where you guys are headed)
Though i also agree you will benefit from color temp adjustment in post.

To David: yep, i usually do my last WB around 45 and try and deal with the rest in editing. When i have turned my "video lights" on, mainly to see my way through wrecks, its always bright red beams of light. Much like taking a photo with strobes and then doing a custom WB on something white in the frame...for me depth didn't change the end result.

 

[danvolker]

Dan and all,

Sounds like if you have a Canon 5d MKIII its low light abilities have pushed the envelope to more capability. Or even your 5D MK II (is that what you have Dan?)

JD and Ambassador; The white balancing using only available light past 50' or so and THEN adding in LED lights was from somewhere Ikelite recommended (can't recall where) so you'd have to try with your lights, your white balancing settings, etc.

My limited understanding of it is past 50' (or 70' or more?) there is very little red / orange for custom white balance to "see". Theory being adding daylight balanced lights AFTER you while balance (and are 2' or so away minimum) the combination can equal a nice "blend" of available light WB and artificial daylight.

Post processing with the latest greatest such as anon 5D MK III can likely also help tremendously.

I'm more a still shooter so others such as JD and Ambassador obviously have tried more........

David Haas
www.haasimages.com

David, and JDandValerie, thanks for the suggestions on this...
I think I will try the more creative uses of the WB controls on the 3 tank and lunch Jimmy has going out Monday....
The first dive will be at first light, and their will be a blue cast to the bottom at 90 feet. Vis is still expected to be excellent.

For the night dive, if I did a Custom white balance of something large and white I could fill most of the screen with, and was so close to it that this was entirely a video light white balancing,,say 2 feet away from dome....would you expect reds to mess up the video later, or would it just fix the color of the video lights?
Oh, and David, I have the 5D Mark II.


Thanks