Why is PADI so conservative?

[meierdierck]

dude i tell everyone i teach its just a card, you CAN do whatever you want, doesnt mean it is smart, it doesnt mean its safe and it doesnt mean you WILL get hurt, it just means yo dont know what you are doing, and it is generally agreed that you SHOULD NOT go below that depth, until you learn the skills to do it safely, you can either think of the OW card as a learners permit to enter the environment and get the skills and education to do what everyone hear loves so much, or you can think of it as a lenght of rope, just long enough to hang yourself.

 

[D_B]

There doesn't seem to be any difference between 60ft and 120ft.

I would point out that the word seem is in italics in Devon's post and I think if you read the whole post that it's from, you'll get the idea that he does not believe that is so, except looking at it on the surface, so to speak

 

[H2Andy]

(yeah, DB, i understand his point ... )

to the original poster:

again, it may seem arbitrary, but there are good reasons to put restrictions on the various certifications. this "eases" you into more complex situations as you build experience

 

[Garrobo]

The 18 meters thing is so much BS as far as I am concerned. I did the Speigle Grove with only ten OW dives under my belt and haven't looked back. The reason that these agencies put out all this stuff is because of liability, lawyers and lawsuits. That's your answer in a nut shell. It's up to you to determine what you can or cannot do. Your life is in your own hands when you jump into the water. If you do not think that you have the guts, experience or the qualifications to do a deep dive, stay on the shallow reefs. If not, you have no one to blame except yourself if you get hurt.

 

[Pitchblack]

Buleetu.

All, and I say all organisations is conservative in their teachings and fundamentals wether it's PADI, NAUI, SSI CMAS or GUE. Some more, some less.

Just becouse a diver is trained by lets say CMAS, it doesnt mean that he is extremely
conservative and dives with a buddy-line all the time and has a margin with 12 minutes to every NDL he encounters.

It is always up to the individuall diver if he or she wants to be conservative or not, if he or she exceeds recommendations or not.

Agiency has nothing to do with conservatism, It's the attitude against diving. Depth-hunters with no proper judgement and respect for what depths greater than training or experience can bring them, just scares the hell out of me.

Actually, for marine life, depths greater than 20 meters are pointless. Sure, some species does live a bit deeper and they are few. I can understand if depth has a pupose, wrecks for an example.

And so there is what has already been discussed, the nitrogen issue. More nitrogen exposure, shorter NDL's and ofcourse the narcosis. I couldnt even think of a blown 1st stage on 30 meters in my darkest nightmares.

And speaking of the cesa, your buddy IS (not shouldI) withing reach in case of ooa. And that should be enough to bring you up and let you do a safety stop.

Cutting corners kills.

Best regards,

 

[Diver0001]

The 18 meters thing is so much BS as far as I am concerned. I did the Speigle Grove with only ten OW dives under my belt and haven't looked back. The reason that these agencies put out all this stuff is because of liability, lawyers and lawsuits. That's your answer in a nut shell. It's up to you to determine what you can or cannot do. Your life is in your own hands when you jump into the water. If you do not think that you have the guts, experience or the qualifications to do a deep dive, stay on the shallow reefs. If not, you have no one to blame except yourself if you get hurt.

Different people naturally accept different levels of risk. I think the 18 metre guideline was an attempt to strike a happy medium between what most people are comfortable with while at the same time minimizing DCS risk with typical recreational gear. YYMV but I would suggest that you probably have a higher risk-tolerance than the average diver.

To suggest that it's BS if anyone sees the world differently than you do is probably a little short-sighted.

R..

 

[InTheDrink]

A newly certified diver died in Grand Cayman recently, going on a dive (100ft) outside of his agencies recommendations for his training (60ft) (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ba...6-divers-dying-cayman-9-last-year-4-year.html).

In my experience once you go below 25m (this is my experience and obvisously subjective) the way your brain work changes enough to make the difference between 60 and 100ft pretty significant.

The main thing is to get comfortable and work your way forward. Don't rush yourself, push forward in sensible strides, challenge yourself, but don't go so far outside of your training that you're out of your depth as it were. If you're not sure what out of your depth (metaphorically) is, then do ask someone with more experience - like you've done here.

And of course, get more training for more challenging dives.

 

[emoreira]

If you don't know the answer to that question, you shouldn't be diving at all.

In spite of all that has been written, I agree with this statement.
It's well known that "fair people pays for sinners". Scuba diving is considered a risky sport for insurance companies. If people can do whatever they want under water, as it's under their own risk, this sport will turn to be considered more than risky. Scuba certifications will be reduced from 15 meters (current recommended limit for OWD) to 10 as it was reduced a few years ago form 18 to 15. Places where accidents or incidents had happended will be considered risky places and closed to scuba agencies, no matter who was to blame. LDSs with incidents will be pointed out.
The effect of depth to the human body is one of the first things that a diver must know. All the OWD classes I assited (SSI) for OW and specialities, all the different instructors made huge efforts for us to understand and get into our heads to have high respect for depth.

 

[CoralSeaMan]

On my second open water dive (after certification) I did the the Santa Rosa Wall in Cozumel (about 90 ft.). I was confident in my skills and equipment. The dive was phenomenal, thrilling and like flying. I had never experienced any thing like it and it keeps me diving to this day. I also ran out of air because I suffered narcosis and not only lost track of time, but was convinced when I did look at my SPG that it was not working properly. Even though I thought I knew about narcosis I did not recognize it and it could have led to my death. The limits are sensible and exist for a reason.

 

[marinediva]

Actually, for marine life, depths greater than 20 meters are pointless. Sure, some species does live a bit deeper and they are few. I can understand if depth has a pupose, wrecks for an example. said by Pitchblack.

I bet you would not make this statement if you have ever dived in PNG.
Plenty of marine life which can ONLY be seen at 30m+, eg hammerheads, Marlin, the biggest fans you could ever photograph just to name a few.