Why the 50bar/700psi rule in the first place?

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Whoa guys!! came up with this idea:

What if we installed a microchip in the tank that "tells" the SPG/computer the tank's volume and doesn't show you pressure, but volume (with the proper conversions, of course)??

Does anybody know a good, cheap patent lawyer??

Gio.
 
PavoDive:
Whoa guys!! came up with this idea:

What if we installed a microchip in the tank that "tells" the SPG/computer the tank's volume and doesn't show you pressure, but volume (with the proper conversions, of course)??

Does anybody know a good, cheap patent lawyer??

Gio.

LOL. Actually I typed this out a couple of posts ago (REALLY!!!) and then thought better of it. Actually what I typed was slightly different:
An SPG with the possibility to mechanically (with a dial or such) set the tank size - and then get the readout by volume!

I'm not sure because I never had one but don't these modern integrated hose-less comps have this already?

But a cheaper manually settable SPG.....hmmmmmmm
 
Marek K:
Ha!! I figured that would get you going!
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Marek. Trolling is not allowed on SB and can lead to serious repercussions! What the punishment might be for trolling a MODERATOR I'll leave to your imagination!!!


(don't worry folks....personal j/k :D )

(note to self: STOP hijacking your own thread!)
 
Kim:
Marek. Trolling is not allowed on SB and can lead to serious repercussions!:D
Hey, you want dialectics, you get dialectics.

(Doh... I did forget you were a Mod, though...)

Seriously, that comment of yours, that we should be considering amount of gas rather than pressure, good as the comment was, did strike me as a touch ironic... since you're a steadfast defender of measuring tank size by (metric) volume, rather than amount of (Imperial) gas. I know, I know... apples and apricots...

--Marek
 
I posted the one above this just as a quick reflex [trying to be funny, did I succeed?], but now that I think it more, pieces come to their places.

Of course we have a lot of divers (up to instructors, and God knows, CDs) thinking in almighty psi. That's what the instrument is showing you, that's where the emphasis is being put!.
Just to show you my point: what does indicate the engine oil gauge in your car?? huh?? oil's temp? pressure? volume? In most cars it doesn't even give you units, you've got a treshold in red and a red lamp, and that's all (at least in most cars I know). So the emphasis there is being put in that "red zone", and the rest is a black box for most of us (by the way, that gauge usually indicates oil's pressure).

I've seen divers that even don't have the 500psiBB rule, they're guided by the red zone in the SPG!!
So even if you mention the importance of proper air management during the OW course (and I think instructors must), odds are [most of] those people will pay more attention to what's being laid in front of their eyes as the most important fact: pressure.

If we want divers to think in terms of volume left, I see three options:
1.- You have them doing rock bottom calculations (IMHO unlikely because of the reasons I exposed in the previous post) or
2.- You standardize the volume of all tanks in the world, so pressure will become meaningful (absurd as it can get) or
3.- You move from the SPG to the SVG (Submersible Volume Gauge), something that will require not few technological (and economical!) developments.

My 0.02 cu.ft. @ 500 psi :D
 
But as to the literal "why," Kim, from your initial post, I think Chris probably hit it right on in Post #5 ... the 500 psi "reserve" was derived from the pressure at which an old J-valve had to be actuated. And that's why all Imperial SPGs that I've ever seen have the red "reserve" zone marked at 500 psi.

And the nearest numbered pressure on DIN gauges is 50 Bar -- also red.

So those numbers are easy for a divemaster to check, and hard for a beginning diver to argue with. (It's still a knee-jerk reaction drilled into me, for me to get worried when I nudge below 500 psi -- even on a shallow 20-ft dive without anyone checking my ending pressure.)

It is an arbitrary figure to a certain extent, seeing as there's a significant difference between 500 psi and 50 Bar.

Of course, your real issue was, why isn't pressure management taught to some degree, from the very start? Excellent question.

--Marek
 
Marek K:
Of course, your real issue was, why isn't pressure management taught to some degree, from the very start? Excellent question.
Thank you Marek! If you substitute volume for pressure in the wording of the above statement, you've hit the nail on the head!
 
Kim:
Thank you Marek! If you substitute volume for pressure in the wording of the above statement, you've hit the nail on the head!
Um, yeah... volume management... :sorry19z: or at least "how much gas you've actually got left, and will need to complete your dive" management...

You know, your gentle correction above is a lot easier to take with your civilized English accent!

--Marek
 
Marek K:
Um, yeah... volume management... :sorry19z: or at least "how much gas you've actually got left, and will need to complete your dive" management...

You know, your gentle correction above is a lot easier to take with your civilized English accent!

--Marek

Thank you again!!

Of course when," "how much gas you've actually got left, and will need to complete your dive" management", is left to advanced training to be introduced - it makes you wonder how people actually get that far (actually I have to wonder how I did!!). It's a good thing that scuba equipment is mostly very reliable these days!
 
I never heard of gas management, or SAC until I started reading about it on this forum. Imediately I recognized that this was important. Thanks to all on the board for bringing this forward to my attention. Since I dive with a 80 cuft tank I can now relate PSI to gas volume. This along with knowing my SAC + a safety margin and average depth I can safely determine my rock bottom pressure and turn my dive accordingly. I usually do this before each dive by using the dive plan we have agreed on. If things go amuck you can adjust quickly and still be safe. Thanks guys for passing along knowledge to us newbes.
 
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