Bitterness of Scuba Instructors

[buddhasummer]

I must say when I first joined the board was on the receiving end of what I perceived were unnecessarily harsh comments. I began to be almost a little scared to post anything or ask anyquestions. I hardened up a little. I try to be very careful when I post as Im aware without face to face communication and without knowing a persons personaility it is easy to sometimes misread the intention and tone of a post. Of course as with any random sample of the general population there are some people on this board who are simply just rude. But I think that number is certainly small. Given that this is a community I think it's good form when witnessing something obviously rude that the poster be called on it. I admit though there have been times when I have just walked on by. I don't come on this board to fight I come to listen, learn, share, have some fun and the occasional chuckle.

 

[fjpatrum]

Not all argument is polite. This is the point. Sometimes people are rude. Arguing is fine. Rudeness isn't.

There are 3 positions you can be in when someone posts something rude:
(1) The insulter
(2) The insulted
(3) An observer

Sure it's entertaining for the observers. Well, duh!

And sure it's entertaining for the insulter.

Not so entertaining for the insulted.

And the fact that the observers and the insulter would be willing to sit down for a beer with the insulted doesn't mean anything at all. The question is, would the insulted want to? I doubt it.

I guess that would all depend upon the nature of the insult and the situation. I have definite disagreements with people on several boards I participate in, including here on SB. So far I have yet to find people so rude or obnoxious that I wouldn't at least meet them in real life and have a drink. Maybe I'm more forgiving than others but I don't think I'm in the minority on this position.

 

[FPDocMatt]

So far I have yet to find people so rude or obnoxious that I wouldn't at least meet them in real life and have a drink. Maybe I'm more forgiving than others but I don't think I'm in the minority on this position.

People who are rude are quick to tell people whose feelings they hurt that they're too sensitive.

If the majority of members of SB feel that the harshness of some of the posts here is not severe enough to warrant taking offense, then perhaps those of us who do should just start a separate, kinder and gentler scuba forum.

I'll tell you one thing. I'm glad that the list of people going to Cozumel in June does not include any of the people on my ignore list.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Not all argument is polite. This is the point. Sometimes people are rude. Arguing is fine. Rudeness isn't.

There are 3 positions you can be in when someone posts something rude:
(1) The insulter
(2) The insulted
(3) An observer

Sure it's entertaining for the observers. Well, duh!

And sure it's entertaining for the insulter.

Not so entertaining for the insulted.

And the fact that the observers and the insulter would be willing to sit down for a beer with the insulted doesn't mean anything at all. The question is, would the insulted want to? I doubt it.

It depends on how seriously you take it, Matt. And that usually boils down to context.

We have an opt-in forum here called "The Pub". Those of us who spend a lot of time there regularly insult each other. Most of us take it as spirited conversation and don't let it bother us. I've had some really heated arguments with several folks in there, and to be honest I really like those folks ... and in fact, have met, dived, and had a beer with some of the ones I disagree with the most.

Now ... here's where context comes in ... that sort of interplay is fine in The Pub ... it's NOT fine here. That forum was created as a social outlet ... this one was created as a place to exchange information.

Context is everything ... and I completely agree that in forums like this one, insulting language isn't appropriate ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

People who are rude are quick to tell people whose feelings they hurt that they're too sensitive.

If the majority of members of SB feel that the harshness of some of the posts here is not severe enough to warrant taking offense, then perhaps those of us who do should just start a separate, kinder and gentler scuba forum.

I'll tell you one thing. I'm glad that the list of people going to Cozumel in June does not include any of the people on my ignore list.

You might be surprised ... I went on the SB Bonaire trip in, oh, I think it was 2005 ... and met a couple of folks I thought I didn't like because of their posting style. They were pretty nice folks to spend time with in real life. Turns out they weren't rude at all ... they just had a sense of humor that doesn't translate well over the internet.

The truly rude ones tend not to have the social skills it would take to even want to go on a trip like that.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[boulderjohn]

People who are rude are quick to tell people whose feelings they hurt that they're too sensitive.

When I was a school administrator, I had to deal with bullies in a school setting. As a member of the central administration of that school district, I was privy to the internal investigation of one of the most well known violent school episodes in history, and no matter what the final police report may say about the shooters' motives, I assure you that bullying was a part of the process that led to it.

I would say that in almost all cases, bullies think their victims are too sensitive and need to toughen up. In several of the cases I dealt with, I saw the proverbial light bulb go off in the offenders' heads as they realized "OMG, I was being a bully!"

 

[fjpatrum]

People who are rude are quick to tell people whose feelings they hurt that they're too sensitive.

True enough. I hope that wasn't you thinking I was saying you were being too sensitive, though, that wasn't my point. My point is we each have a different tolerance level to "rudeness". Clearly your tolerance to rudeness is a little lower than mine as you have taken umbrage (apparently) to things I have not been bothered by. When I see what I consider rudeness, I say something about it. I hope others do the same when I say rude things (it happens).

If the majority of members of SB feel that the harshness of some of the posts here is not severe enough to warrant taking offense, then perhaps those of us who do should just start a separate, kinder and gentler scuba forum.

I think the "screw you guys I'm going home and taking my toys with me" attitude displayed in that statement is more likely to have people tell you you're being too sensitive than anything. You've had things thrown at you in this thread from being called sensitive to being called elitist, and I think you've handled it all with aplomb. I think most of the posts on here have been reasonably supportive of your position, even if they didn't entirely agree your position was 100% justified.

I'll tell you one thing. I'm glad that the list of people going to Cozumel in June does not include any of the people on my ignore list.

I still say, if I were going to Coz, I wouldn't rule out anyone and I've never put anyone on an "ignore list" on any forum. Part of that is because I see miscommunications every day in real life with people arguing the same point from two different perspectives and not realizing they agree. It's only worse in written communication. Part of it is because I like "spirited" debate, as long as it doesn't degenerate to name calling of an abusive nature unrelated to the topic. IE I don't mind being called a stupid newb but I would mind being called an idiot on general principle. Slight nuance, but it makes a difference to me. It might not be different things in your opinion.

I hope you enjoy Coz. I wish I were able to go. And, by the way, if you want to do any local quarry (cold) diving, feel free to PM me. I'd enjoy meeting and diving with you, I think.

 

[TSandM]

You know, it's funny, but you can find common ground even with people you think you never would . . . I've become friends with at least one person on this board where I think it would enormously surprise most people that we've made a connection. I went diving a couple of years ago with someone with whom I had been at rather bitter odds on our local forum . . . I think we discovered we actually liked one another a LOT, and had far more in common than we had differences. In the end, after all, we are all divers, and we really share that.

There are a very few really bad pennies.

 

[FPDocMatt]

I think the "screw you guys I'm going home and taking my toys with me" attitude displayed in that statement...

I didn't mean it that way at all. I just figure that, if the majority of the people on this forum accept a certain level of what I would call rudeness, then that's what the majority wants. We shouldn't try and change it. If those of us who are thinner-skinned want a kindler and gentler forum, we'll just have to set it up and run it ourselves.

 

[mathauck0814]

I didn't mean it that way at all. I just figure that, if the majority of the people on this forum accept a certain level of what I would call rudeness, then that's what the majority wants. We shouldn't try and change it. If those of us who are thinner-skinned want a kindler and gentler forum, we'll just have to set it up and run it ourselves.

... and convince knowledgeable people to contribute content there while you police everyone through your filter of perceived "rudeness" ...