Tipping the boat crew - conventions around the world?

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But isn't the conundrum that tipping has spread and continues to spread to places where it was not historically the custom to tip? I believe it is me and my fellow Americans who are largely responsible. What about countries that are becoming accustomed to tipping but where it's not yet fully expected? Should Canadians, Aussies, Scandinavians, etc., feel obliged to tip in such places? It's easy to say "When in Rome" but not always easy to know when one is really "in Rome." The presence of a tip box may or may not mean that the place truly has a tipping culture--it may be more wishful thinking ("hey, Americans visit us and they like to tip!") than a matter of survival for the crew. It's sometimes difficult to know. In the US, we all know that service industry workers who are legally paid less than the "normal" minimum wage need, expect, and deserve the tip to survive, as it is essentially part of their normal compensation. But I don't know and can't know how it works in all places in the world. As an American, I will generally tip in an unfamiliar place unless I'm specifically told it's just not done there. But I don't expect people who come from non-tipping cultures to do the same.

Not sure why it would matter what the customs were in 1966 of a place you're visiting in 2013.

To eliminate the mystery of the local tipping etiquette in places you are going to visit, if a traveler cares enough to want to know, its probably in a guide book, most will always have a section on tipping, experienced travel agents can help you, or there is the wonderful thing you're surfing now just chock full of information and opinions. None of us really need to wait to be told what to do, we can find out easily in advance if we care to.
 
The presence of a tip box may or may not mean that the place truly has a tipping culture--it may be more wishful thinking ("hey, Americans visit us and they like to tip!") than a matter of survival for the crew.
I can say that here we get planeloads of Aussies and Scandis and almost no Americans, and yet there's a tip box on every boat, so the theory that Americans are "spoiling" locals and creating a tipping culture where one hadn't previously existed won't hold water, at least not here in SE Asia. Many visitors to Thailand assume that because nobody tips in restaurants that there's no tipping culture. However, there is a mandatory 10% service charge added to every restaurant bill and to every hotel bill, and this percentage is specifically earmarked for distribution to employees. The employees do in fact know about this, and there has even been industrial action against a prominent hotel chain at which employees felt they were not getting their due. So the tip is there, but you just don't pay it separately (in much the same way that GST or VAT taxes are bundled into a price in some countries while sales tax is added to the price in the US). For tours here in Thailand, though, there is no service charge, and the general practice is to tip 300-500THB (about 10-15 USD) for a daytrip. My point is that you can't simply apply assumptions you gain from one culture to a different one. In the US, restaurants don't add a service charge, and patrons tip; here they do add a service charge, and patrons don't tip. As we say here, "same-same, but different."
 
No, it's not ridiculous at all. If the crew go to the effort of putting a tip box out, they are most definitely inviting their customers to use it. If it were culturally unacceptable, the box wouldn't be there at all.
There's a difference between "not culturally acceptable" and "not necessary, not expected".

I see tip jars on café counters all around here in Norway. Still, I'm not obliged to tip for my cup of coffee, and I won't stiff the waiter if I don't tip for a single beer or a cup of coffee (except perhaps rounding upwards on the price of the beer). If I were working in the service industry, I'd sure as hell make it possible for customers to tip if they wanted to even if I weren't depending on tips to make a half-decent salary, and I fully expect the waiters to do the same.

On a lighter note, regarding the "when in Rome" meme: gratuity ( tips) in Rome - where and how much? - Rome Forum - TripAdvisor
 
Tipping is cultural. The American system has us tipping for a variety of services from the shoeshine guy to the tennis pro. Most dive boat crew in the USA (other than very few) are not paid high wages and the "crew tip" becomes part of compensation.

When American divers travel expect to tip. If you are not sure just ask the Captain or the Charter Organizer, or the person you book the dive trip with.

Typical Tips

15-20% of your charter fee is fair on big trips where you are on board for many days. OR $5/$10 per dive done if the % method yields too low a number.

$1000 multi day trip with meals, camera handling, bunks etc. $150-$200 is reasonable

$5000 liveaboard ...... $500 is really nice (think about how you would tip at a quality hotel)

$75 1/2 day trip in the keys. $20 is nice

you work out the math on the rest.

Traveling to foriegn places? Bring some goodies in your gear bag. Line reel, SMB, Pop CDs, etc..... dont use them for diving but bring them for little extra goodies for people that do nice things ..... it goes a long way.

If your service is lacking don't stew and wait till the end of the trip. Step up to the wheel house and talk to the Captain.

Cheers

Who are you tipping at these hotels? The only people I will tip is the maid, if they do a good job on the first day! Room service, but most include the tip!

Now as far as diving is concerned, the only time I've been confused about tipping was in Hawaii, you may go out with an OP that doesn't have their own boat, how do you tip then? I was also doing my certification dives with them, so I had paid for those, do you tip for that also?
 
In the US I see different tipping practices depending on if the boat caters to locals or tourist.

For example in So Calif, I frequent several large dive boats. They include multiple meals, bunks for sleeping the night before. I (an many others) use the same boat multiple times per year. The captains and crew will cater to your specific needs to a degree. For example, my favorite dive boat does not provide tanks and its a pain for me to rent one (I am 1000 miles from home), all I do is ask and they magically have a tank to loan me and the tip gets increased appropriately. I always tip (5-10/tank) and more than 1/2 the people appear to tip also, also maybe a little less.

The opposite was in FL, most of the divers were tourist. The boats offer less service and tips were a lot more hit and miss, some folks probably thought heck I not coming back soon so I can be cheap. Other have no problem tossing in a 20. I had multiple days booked, tipped and the combination of my good behavior and tip resulted them them catering to me, just little things that made the dive dives nicer. I saw similar practices in HI. In both places, the tourist had the money, not the desire.

I have also screwed up and tipped where is it not polite....oops. I have learned to travel with gifts to these places.
 
Not sure why it would matter what the customs were in 1966 of a place you're visiting in 2013.

I agree, but the tricky part is knowing what is genuinely expected (in essence, REQUIRED) in the country in 2013. As has been stated before in this thread and elsewhere, in the US the tip, at least in the case of restaurant servers and similar workers who are considered "tipped employees" by the IRS, is part of the employee's normal compensation. Regardless of the historical origins of tipping, it really has little to do anymore with whether the service was exceptional or not. This is an alien concept elsewhere. So the question is what does a tip really mean in a particular place in 2013?

To eliminate the mystery of the local tipping etiquette in places you are going to visit, if a traveler cares enough to want to know, its probably in a guide book, most will always have a section on tipping, experienced travel agents can help you, or there is the wonderful thing you're surfing now just chock full of information and opinions. None of us really need to wait to be told what to do, we can find out easily in advance if we care to.

That is exactly what I do before visiting an unfamiliar country. But general travel advice is often not going to be of much help when it comes to tipping dive industry people. I just reached over to my shelf full of Lonely Planet and Rough Guide guidebooks and pulled out Indonesia. I was surprised not to find anything on tipping (though I suppose I could have missed it). That said, it's clear that the expectation at a local warung is very different from the expectation at a well-known international luxury dive resort or liveaboard. Dive resorts and liveaboards are generally totally different animals from local businesses. But there are many gradations in between the two extremes, including modest dive shops visited more by the international backpacker set than well-heeled Americans. What to do?

In contrast to Indonesia, my Lonely Planet Egypt book has a whole section on the topic of baksheesh--the practice of "tipping" pretty much everyone for pretty much everything, though often in tiny amounts. The section notes that in hotels and restaurants a 12% service charge is included, but one should still leave a little baksheesh for the waiter because the service charge goes into the till. Confusing? I'm sure it can be. It's not clear how this applies to the dive industry. My guess is that because of the baksheesh culture, tipping in some amount is expected by local dive industry employees. How much does one leave? An American-sized tip or what locals might expect based on what employees in other local industries receive? I would leave an American-sized tip in Egypt, but as I said in my previous post, I can't imagine the locals would fault, say, a Scandinavian for leaving something more modest. I just don't like the idea of one-size-fits-all tipping everywhere in the world. As I said, I completely agree with the adage "When in Rome do as the Romans do," but I noted that it's not always easy to know what to do when it comes to tipping for diving. The guidebooks just aren't that helpful when trying to translate local customs into what to do at dive operations.

I can say that here we get planeloads of Aussies and Scandis and almost no Americans, and yet there's a tip box on every boat, so the theory that Americans are "spoiling" locals and creating a tipping culture where one hadn't previously existed won't hold water, at least not here in SE Asia. . . .

The tip box concept didn't just magically occur one day to some Thai who had never been exposed to Western culture. Rather, I suspect the idea was imported by someone who had seen it elsewhere. The presence of a tip box can mean either "in setting our wages, our boss assumes we receive tips as part of our normal compensation that we need in order to survive" (as in the US) or "it would be nice if someone left us a little show of gratitude to supplement our pay." It's difficult to know.

I like the idea of a service charge. If restaurants in some region customarily add a service charge, why not dive operations in that region? One would still be free to slip the divemaster a little extra on top of the service charge if they wished to, but at least people who chose not to would not be criticized by the international dive community as being "cheap."

In reality, the more international resorts and liveaboards these days all seem to make their expectations known with respect to the sticky issue of tipping. From what I've experienced, they are not bashful about addressing it (hopefully tactfully) in their welcome speech or at some other point during one's stay. Smaller operations often don't say anything, so it's hard to know what to do there. In that case, I try to size up my fellow divers. If they're a bunch of 20 year-old backpackers with threadbare rental gear, I'll probably leave a more modest tip than I would if they were well-heeled divers on a luxe liveaboard.
 
I will echo the thoughts of those who are thoroughly baffled about what to do in different parts of the world. Heck, I am totally baffled about what to do in many cases within the United States. I go to a coffee bar, tell the clerk I just want a coffee, and I am handed a paper cup. Next to the clerk is a tip jar. A tip handing me a paper cup into which I myself will pour a $4 cup of coffee from an urn on another table? Are you kidding me? The clerk at the grocery checkout line does a heck of a lot more of the same work, and I don't tip for that service.

People who play golf will be familiar with the custom at the end of a round of having some joker trap you as you return to the clubhouse and start wiping off your already clean clubheads with a dirty wet rag. You neither want nor need that service, but you will be regarded as a cheapskate if you don't tip for it. I saw an article in a golf magazine that said a $5 tip per bag was normal. If a foursome comes in every 8-10 minutes and if there are two such jokers holding you up that way, those guys would be making $60-$80 an hour in tips for that.

As for guidebooks...

Years ago my wife and I went to Fiji, arriving in the pre-dawn darkness. We had pre-paid for a 2-hour taxi ride from the airport to our hotel, and our driver was waiting for us. We had read in our guide book that tipping was not part of the custom in Fiji "except in the case of extraordinary service." Throughout the entire two hour drive, the taxi driver talked about Fiji and gave us a tremendous amount of very helpful information. We were thoroughly absorbed by the conversation. When we arrived at our hotel, he carried our luggage up into the room and did all sorts of things to make sure we were OK and ready for vacation. I figured he had driven 2 hours to pick us up, given us a 2 hour excellent and informative ride, and done everything but carry us up the stairs to our room, all for what was probably a small percentage of our pre-paid fare. I decided this was extraordinary, and I gave him a tip that was smaller than I would have given to someone in a tipping culture. I thought he was going to faint when he got it. I later learned I had tipped him about a day's pay. I learned that in that area, taxi drivers do not work hard for tips. They work hard so that the next time you need a ride, you will not ask for "a taxi,"--you will ask for that specific taxi driver who gave you such great service.
 
Americans demand cheap products and have no problem filling their homes (and dive bags) with stuff made by people making squat to the point their own people are unemployed. Then they travel and think everyone should tip generously to US standards. That is a crazy.
 
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Americans demand cheap products and have no problem filling their homes (and dive bags) with stuff made by people making squat to the point their own people are unemployed. Then they travel and think everyone should tip generously. That is a crazy.

I missed the part where Americans think everyone should tip generously. Sounds like some sour grapes.

If anybody has any questions about tipping, can't find it in a guide book, can't find it on the internet, can't get their question answered here on scubaboard, you can private message me and I will fill you in on any destination you request, just make sure you tip me afterwards.
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No Mike, no sour grapes at all. Low skilled workers in the US make about $75-$80 a day. In Mexico they make $50 a week. I don't tip to US standards in Mexico, although you may if you want.

Aq
I missed the part where Americans think everyone should tip generously. Sounds like some sour grapes.

If anybody has any questions about tipping, can't find it in a guide book, can't find it on the internet, can't get their question answered here on scubaboard, you can private message me and I will fill you in on any destination you request, just make sure you tip me afterwards.
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https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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