How do you feel about upside down trim pockets on waist for BP/W ballast solution?

[TSandM]

This gets back to the fundamental problem with weight systems: You want something that will retain the weight securely when it is desired to retain it, and release it rapidly and easily, when it need to be jettisoned.

Personally, the only time I envision dropping weights is with a distressed diver on the surface, and I don't want to be within reach of a panicked person long enough to open a Fastex clip AND reach into the pocket AND try to wiggle out a 5 pound weight. Opening the clip can be done quickly, and the weight will fall -- or at least, one hopes it will.

I'm a victim of the plural of anecdote not being data, but after 10 years and over a thousand dives, I have yet to drop my weights or anybody else's, but I have LOST a 5 lb weight during a dive, and that was a major PITA on ascent. So I would vote for something like a DUI Weight & Trim harness, to separate your weights so they aren't all on your rig, and retain them pretty darned securely until somebody is really determined to remove them. That is assuming you are unwilling to look at a weight belt at all -- I use a rubber one with a tongued buckle, which holds my weights securely but WILL release easily when required.

 

[BRT]

26 lbs of lead, ~6 lbs of plate and harness (assuming a stainless plate) 2 lbs of regulator and ~-2 lbs of empty tank = ~36 lbs of total ballast, wow.

Now add ~9 lbs of gas to your cylinder. 36 +9 = 45 lbs.

If you hang all of your required ballast on your rig you will need a *huge* singles wing to be able to float your gear if you need to ditch it.


I'd suggest you verify that your drysuit is actually 36 lbs buoyant

&

I'd look into carrying at least a portion of your ballast on your person, either on a belt or weight harness.

Tobin

Weight Nazi Alert!

 

[kwinter]

If you really need that much lead, you only need a small amount of it to be ditchable. Think about a V-weight or maybe DSS weights if you have a DSS plate. Adding most of the weight to your plate makes it more comfortable. You would only need 1 or 2 pockets with a few pounds that you could ditch. Or use a weight harness designed for the purpose.


iPhone. iTypo. iApologize.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Weight Nazi Alert!

I have only suggested that 1) the OP verify he needs as much ballast as he is using, and 2) he consider the impacts of how he is configuring this ballast.

Not once did I suggest he was using more than required.

What exactly is wrong with either of these suggestions?

Tobin

---------- Post added April 23rd, 2015 at 08:50 PM ----------

Weight Nazi Alert!

You do realize that pretty much the largest singles wings offered by any brand is a 45 lbs wing, and that most are far smaller?

Do you consider it good practice to configure a singles rig so that it will be 45 lbs negative with a full tank. Please explain.

Tobin

 

[kr2y5]

I was never very comfortable with my weight pockets opening downwards, and I was happy to get to a point where I could just get rid of them. Not keen on ditchable weight that could come out accidentally. The one time I actually needed to release my Halcyon weight pockets (while doing a weight check at 15 feet), it was a huge PITA, and at that time, I realized it would be even more of a PITA in an emergency situation. This finally convinced me that doing away with the damned pockets is the way to go...

 

[Keith.M]

Ballast is anything that does not float.

You have about 30 lbs total if you include your regulator and empty HP 100.


Tobin

That is a good point. I haven't gone to that all on my bpw. I currently wear 10 on a belt. The two wings I use are a 30 and a 32, so I might reconsider.

The only reason I have been considering it is because I am not sure how much wear and tear a belt will have on my zipper.

I have heard some people say belts take their toll on a zipper. But I don't know that first hand.

 

[TSandM]

I've been diving weight belts for ten years. I've never had a zipper problem as a result. In fact, the only zipper problem I've had was with a Fusion with about 450 dives on it, and the zipper on that suit is nowhere near the weight belt

 

[KenGordon]

Do you consider it good practice to configure a singles rig so that it will be 45 lbs negative with a full tank. Please explain.

Tobin

By 'rig' do you mean the cylinder/BC/weights as a standalone unit? Are you saying that it will sink even if the wing is full?

To the OP. Round here everyone dives a drysuit. Thus people have the same issue with weights. A common solution is integrated weights in a BC. Unfortunately this makes the 'rig' more unstable when tied up on the boat bench going to and from the site. Also moving them about becomes harder. You may also suffer from that.

A weight belt with up to 8kg in soft weights is not too horrid, try splitting some of the weight off the waist band and onto a belt. Since you now have some proper ditchable weight the ones left could be threaded hard weights.

I have previously used a weight harness, but I find that they are ok with a waistcoat style BC but you get webbing clash with a bp/wing, lots of things want to be in the same place.

I don't plan to have ditchable weight but only manage that in fresh water with a twinset, otherwise I have a bit to a lot.

There is no substitute for a proper weight check. Being too heavy is no fun at all. I have had to deal with people convinced they need more weight yet able to lie on the bottom with an empty tank and still argue for more. Usually they say 'I keep loosing it and floating up therefore I need more weight'. Of course the answer is they need less air in their BC.

 

[cool_hardware52]

By 'rig' do you mean the cylinder/BC/weights as a standalone unit? Are you saying that it will sink even if the wing is full?

If you look at my first post you will see that this diver's "rig" plate, harness, reg, full cylinder, and ballast attached to his rig approaches 45 lbs total negative when the cylinder is full. (assuming a Stainless plate)

If you need to ditch your gear your wing needs to be able to float this *entire* load, so yes he would need a wing that offers more than 45 lbs of lift. Where do you source a ~50 lbs singles wing?


This is the downside of hanging 100% of your ballast on your rig. Your wing needs to be able to float *all* of your ballast and *all* of your gas.

If the diver moved ballast equal to the weight of his gas (~8 lbs) to his person, his wing now needs to float only 37 lbs. 40 lbs singles wings are common.

A diver wearing a 36 lbs positive exposure suit has zero need to ditch an 8 lbs weight belt after he ditches his rig, and pretty much anyone can manage a 4-6-8 lbs weight belt.

Tobin

 

[ams511]

There is no substitute for a proper weight check. Being too heavy is no fun at all. I have had to deal with people convinced they need more weight yet able to lie on the bottom with an empty tank and still argue for more. Usually they say 'I keep loosing it and floating up therefore I need more weight'. Of course the answer is they need less air in their BC.

A wetsuit diver could lie on the bottom with an empty tank and no air in the BC, yet still need to struggle to keep from rising to the surface at 15 feet as the suit regains its buoyancy. In my opinion it is best to do a weight check at 15 feet with a near empty tank in the same type of water you want to do the dive. However, I was taught to check using fin pivots and floating on the surface at eye level neither which really gives a good idea of weight needed during the safety stop.