Anti ScubaPro bias?

[drrich2]

In my experience as a part time reg. tech for a shop that services nearly every brand. Scubapro has a history of supporting their gear for a very long time with parts availability. But everything eventually reaches a point where it is no longer supported. I fully understand wanting your expensive gear purchases to last a long time but i feel like we need reasonable expectations. How many of you are driving cars from the 80s or watching a 20 year old television?

A fair point, but if you compare a car from the 80's or a t.v. from 2003 to one today, you'll find a drastic difference. Are the regulators of today so different from those 20 years ago? I don't presume to know, just asking.

 

[Lorenzoid]

SB folks in this thread are likely not the stereotypical consumer who frequently replaces their stuff with "new" stuff. I drive a 20 year-old vehicle, my TV is at least 10 years old, my iPhone is 8 years old, and I hope my regulators last at least 20 years. I appreciate that electronic stuff becomes obsolete quickly, but quality mechanical stuff should last decades, and manufacturers should do the best they can to offer replacement parts as long as possible. That said, if you truly own an "antique" (which my vehicle is rapidly becoming), the onus is on you to locate suitable replacement parts.

 

[OMyMyOHellYes]

A fair point, but if you compare a car from the 80's or a t.v. from 2003 to one today, you'll find a drastic difference. Are the regulators of today so different from those 20 years ago? I don't presume to know, just asking.

You've not seen the flat panel OLED 4K or 8K UHD 85" regulators?

 

[James79]

A fair point, but if you compare a car from the 80's or a t.v. from 2003 to one today, you'll find a drastic difference. Are the regulators of today so different from those 20 years ago? I don't presume to know, just asking.

Nope. The tech behind regs hasn't really changed for 4-6 decades. Most "new and improved" things in regs are just marketing and cosmetics.

Respectfully,

James

 

[BoltSnap]

Most "new and improved" things in regs are just marketing and cosmetics.

I disagree. While not many "revolutionary" breakthrough in regulator design have come to market in the last couple of decades, there certainly have been many "evolutionary/incremental" designs and enhancements that came to the market. There are certainly "gimmicky" additions to regulator designs over the years that have come and gone, the Mares Ruby design for example.

Your line of thinking underestimating the upgrades and enhancements that were introduced to regulator design over the past many years and is shared by few people reflects society's getting used to the very fast paced technological advancements that took place in the computer and electronics segments (and related markets). People are now expecting the same pace to be present in all industries and markets which is totally unrealistic and doesn't take into consideration the special and unique aspects of each market and industry. Certainly, it doesn't take into account the disparity of market size between all of these industries.

 

[James79]

I disagree. While not many "revolutionary" breakthrough in regulator design have come to market in the last couple of decades, there certainly have been many "evolutionary/incremental" designs and enhancements that came to the market. There are certainly "gimmicky" additions to regulator designs over the years that have come and gone, the Mares Ruby design for example.

Your line of thinking underestimating the upgrades and enhancements that were introduced to regulator design over the past many years and is shared by few people refelcts society's getting used to the very fast paced technological advancements that took place in the computer and electronics segments (and related markets). People are now expecting the same pace to be present in all industries and markets which is totally unrealistic and doesn't take into consideration the special and unique aspects of each market and industry. Certainly it doesn't take into account the disparity of market size in each industry.

You will note that I said "most", not "all", " new and improved". But for most recreational divers (not do extreme depths, deco, or DPVs) a well tuned reg will breathe great.... Whether it's a 70's Conshelf, brand new Aqualung legend elite, SP 109, or brand new A700 (or whatever their current claimed best is). This has nothing to do with the pace of other industries changes, and more to do with the fact that a regulator is just a demand valve... And physics doesn't change. Incremental improvements have been made, but they are mostly of a nature that the average diver won't notice any difference (other than the weight of their wallet).

Respectfully,

James

 

[BoltSnap]

You will note that I said "most", not "all", " new and improved". But for most recreational divers (not do extreme depths, deco, or DPVs) a well tuned reg will breathe great.... Whether it's a 70's Conshelf, brand new Aqualung legend elite, SP 109, or brand new A700 (or whatever their current claimed best is). This has nothing to do with the pace of other industries changes, and more to do with the fact that a regulator is just a demand valve... And physics doesn't change. Incremental improvements have been made, but they are mostly of a nature that the average diver won't notice any difference (other than the weight of their wallet).

Respectfully,

James

Again, I disagree with you strongly. I am not going to get into the specifics of each regulator from the distant past and the current models but you're not accurate at all to say the least.

physics doesn't change.

Physics doesn't change as we understand it but it can be "manipulated" differently as we mature in our understanding of sciences and expand our expertise and ingenuity in engineering design and manufacturing. If we went by your statement that physics doesn't change, and didn't bother to explore "better mouse traps," we would be still using the slide rules and riding in horse carriages "everything worth inventing had been invented."

Account Suspended

 

[James79]

Again, I disagree with you strongly. I am not going to get into the specifics of each regulator from the distant past and the current models but you're not accurate at all to say the least.

So, your argument is to the effect of "you're wrong, but I won't discuss"?
I acknowledged that there are incremental changes... I simply have seen first hand that a well tuned reg is a well tuned reg WITHIN normal recreational usage. And in that regime, the average user won't note any significant difference.

Physics doesn't change as we understand it but it can be "manipulated" differently as we mature in our understanding of sciences and expand our expertise and ingenuity in engineering design and manufacturing. If we went by your statement that physics doesn't change, and didn't bother to explore "better mouse traps," we would be still using the slide rules and riding in horse carriages "everything worth inventing had been invented."

Again, I acknowledge that there are improvements. Never did I say we shouldn't explore better mousetraps. You are putting up a strawman argument.
I've spoken my piece on the subject... We can agree to disagree.

 

[davehicks]

Again, I disagree with you strongly. I am not going to get into the specifics of each regulator from the distant past and the current models but you're not accurate at all to say the least.





Physics doesn't change as we understand it but it can be "manipulated" differently as we mature in our understanding of sciences and expand our expertise and ingenuity in engineering design and manufacturing. If we went by your statement that physics doesn't change, and didn't bother to explore "better mouse traps," we would be still using the slide rules and riding in horse carriages "everything worth inventing had been invented."

Account Suspended

You are correct that engineering and materials are constantly improving year after year. In many fields the advances in just the last ten year have been stunning. (Look up the details of the SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket - incredible)

On the other hand I am diving a ScubraPro Mk25 1st stage from 2003 that is nearly identical to another Mk25 I got in 2019. Both use the same service kit and are completely interchangeable. I suppose I could spend a lot of money on a newer Titanium model, but otherwise this design will likely still be sold nearly unchanged in another 20 years.

 

[Joneill]

I just sold my '85 Corvette, and the next owner is driving it daily. SONY BRAVIA TV is from +/- 2005...

Plus my regularly dove DH regs are 1958-67, and I have a number of SP regs from the 60's and 70's that I frequently dive...

Cars and TV’s have progressed to much higher standards since you bought those relics so the newer models are truly and meaningfully better in many ways.

Regulators? Not so much advancement to obsolete the old stuff that still works and is serviceable!