Concerns about the Dutch DIR-NL mailing list and (Dutch) DIR diving in general...

[roccoh]

List,

As you might have noticed today the members list has considerably shrinked in size today.

The reason for this "list cleansing" is that the objectives of the DIR-NL list have changed. To start the first selection a poll was started last week with the question "who is interested in/needs a DIR-NL demo day?" Members replying this poll with "no" or without replying at all have been removed from the list. These members show, in our view, not enough interest in the DIR philosophy.

We seem to have lost the objectivs of the DIR-NL list which was: promoting DIR diving in The Netherlands. Several web sites like www.frogkick.nl et.al. are available today and books exist and publications regulary get issued. (roccoh: this is the most correct translation of this sentence!! ) It's time for DIR-NL to issue a few changes and raise the bar to a new height. Dir-NL is solely for exchanging information about DIR-NL and nothing else. The renewed objective of the DIR-NL list is to create DIR divers and nothing else.

Up until this point the DIR-NL has offered its services without asking something in return. This will change now. Not by paying a entrance fee, but by desiring commitment of its members.

This means that all members on the DIR-NL should be DIR divers or have the the intention of becoming one and should commitment on the list and in the water. Divers only subcribed to the list "just for reading pleasure", or to get ideas for their own way of diving are no longer welcome. Just from the information on www.frogkick.nl one should be able to conclude that DIR is or is not a new way of diving for this person. Being a member of the list won't be of any additional value.

From now on, DIR-NL will only spend his resources on (pending) DIR divers. Members not choosing for DIR are voluntary asked to unsubscribe. Members not showing (enough) progress will be removed from the list.


New, pending members need to have a "sponsor" meaning get introduced by a DIR-NL member and have attended at least one meeting or dive with the "hard core" DIR-NL members. New DIR -NL members without any contacts will be introduced to other DIR divers from his or her surroundings. Every DIR-NL member will be encouraged to lent a helping hand. All of this is intended to make the DIR-NL list more personal.

"Free" and "anonymous" email addresses will not be allowed on the list to ban so called fakers. Members using these kind of email addresses are requested to change this before the 1st of July 2004.

DIR-NL will organise a dive day in May/June where all (new) members of DIR-NL are welcome, more news will follow.

Have fun on the DIR-NL list!

DIR-NL

Is this normal DIR behaviour? Is this considered promotion for the DIR philosophy in general and for the Dutch DIR diving community specifically? What if you where unable to answer this poll? When are you considered to be 100% DIR diver? who determines this? what are the requirements for qualification?

What is the opinion of the DIR-community about this behaviour, 'cause I do not consider this kind of behaviour constructive for the DIR community as a whole.


an troubled ex-DIR-NL list member

 

[Wijbrandus]

Rocco,

I've been waiting for a response on your post for some time. I don't know the answer to your questions specifically, but I am a little surprised at the tone of the letter the List sent you. Here in America, I've recieved nothing but support from the DIR community on my interest in their way of diving. I've been encouraged to read everything they have, and several have gone out of their way to offer further advice and learning opportunities.

I wonder if this note you recieved is simply from the List Moderator who has decided to take matters into his own hands to control what he sees as "off-topic" discussions. I agree that it doesn't appear to be a constructive letter, but then I'm not on any pure DIR lists, so I don't know if this is a peculiarity to the community or not. It just doesn't sound like what I've heard from people on SB or elsewhere.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Is this normal DIR behaviour?

Since I'm not DIR, I'll only address this question ... from the perspective of someone on the outside fringe of the local DIR community.

No ... this is not normal DIR behaviour ... at least not in my area. And the Seattle area has a fairly large DIR community.

DIR is, in some respects, exclusive ... but not to the point of shutting off everyone who doesn't want to "commit" to DIR. Here, it's common to see DIR people diving with non-DIR people. I do it all the time. What they ask is that you familiarize yourself with how they dive, adopt some of the basics of safe diving, and learn how to use your fins properly ... no DIR diver wants to be part of a buddy team that silts the place up.

I've rarely met a DIR diver who wants to enforce their beliefs on anyone ... and never felt the urge to associate with one who did. The DIR divers I know are happy to explain to anyone how they dive ... and why ... but do not ask anyone to "commit" to their way of diving. The letter you posted ... to my concern ... smacks of some kind of zealotry.

That letter doesn't in any way reflect the attitude of the DIR divers I know ... and I know a good many. Heck, I'll be spending the next few days diving in a group of 10 ... six of whom are DIR-trained and four of whom are not. I don't expect to see anyone excluding anyone else ... one way or the other.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[geraldp]

Since I'm not DIR, I'll only address this question ... from the perspective of someone on the outside fringe of the local DIR community.

No ... this is not normal DIR behaviour ... at least not in my area. And the Seattle area has a fairly large DIR community.

<snip>

Yowsa: This kind of post (from the DIR-NL mod) smacks of the exact sentiment that keeps a lot of divers away from DIR. I haven't been formally trained in DIR, but I've picked up Jablonski's Fundamentals book and I'm learning. The few DIR divers I've met have been very helpful (as have you guys on this forum). However as I share my learning experiences with non-DIR divers I'm consistently met with prejudices related to the above attitudes.
Just my 2 cents...

 

[roakey]

Is this normal DIR behaviour?

No it's not, and given that it's not, I'm unable to answer any of your immediate follow-up questions, sorry...

What is the opinion of the DIR-community about this behaviour, 'cause I do not consider this kind of behaviour constructive for the DIR community as a whole.

Every group has its saints and every group has its sinners.

Roak

 

[boomx5]

this is not normal behavior. On the other hand, it is their list so I guess they can do whatever they want; it just seems quite a bit closed minded in my opinion.

 

[JeffG]

Yowsa: This kind of post (from the DIR-NL mod) smacks of the exact sentiment that keeps a lot of divers away from DIR. I haven't been formally trained in DIR, but I've picked up Jablonski's Fundamentals book and I'm learning. The few DIR divers I've met have been very helpful (as have you guys on this forum). However as I share my learning experiences with non-DIR divers I'm consistently met with prejudices related to the above attitudes.
Just my 2 cents...

Yowsa...And the kind of divers that prejudice a system because of an email...Wow.....

 

[hijumpr]

Doesn't sound DIR at all.
Gerald, you are not alone with "as I share my learning experiences with non-DIR divers I'm consistently met with prejudices related to the above attitudes". I get that too, but after they actually meet and talk with someone who explains the holistic approach, takes the time to show the gear config and why it works so well, non-DIR divers that I know dismiss that prejudice. The real eye openers come in the water with most non-DIR divers who dive with a DIR team.