Deep Diving on Air

[MXGratefulDiver]

The only thing that came as a surprise to me 200 ft below Kosrae a few weeks ago was how very bright it was and how much coral was still below me. It would be very easy to reach 400 ft and 0 PSI there...! The water was so clear I could see the boat and a guy leaning over the side looking down.

That said, my thoughts are that if someone wants to go down to extreme depths with only a PADI OW certification and two dives under the belt on regular air, more power to them. It is not my job to care for them and someones own personal choices do not affect me.

I am here to point and laugh....just as I would expect everyone to do to me if I ever meet Poseidon doing something stupid as hell underwater.

Sometimes when someone does something stupid, someone else ends up paying the price. The notion that stupid diving acts only harm the diver doing them is a fallacy ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Hank49]

Life is short. Break the rules, and never regret anything that makes you smile.

Your sig line (minus that mushy bullsh*t). I remember smiling after some deep air dives. I know I broke some rules (whose rules, I'm not sure).
I know you want to, but you can't save them all. And you've been trying for the 7 plus years I've been on SB.
I suppose you'll continue to do so. I love you man.

 

[boulderjohn]

Well another diver in training died looks like instructors for new divers need some training, or is that all you can do is whine your way on post.

Link, please?

 

[Charlie59]

Let me take just one parting shot. I'm NOT convinced that technical diving is insurance against anything bad happening to someone. It appears that those who are involved in technical diving increase their task loading and add several levels of complexity to diving. Switching tanks and long deco periods mean being below water for very long stretches. The people who I have known who are involved in technical diving get very excited at first but then do little technical diving and end up selling their equipment.

From what I have seen, many of the people who get into tech diving do not spend enough time actually diving deep to be proficient, yet they do complicated dives with more confidence. It is that confidence in tech diving that is just as problematic or more than diving deep on air (within limits).

I don't think it is constructive to be so flipant as to say "that should be tech diving" as if that is really an answer. I find it particularly amusing when many of the people so certain of their opinions have more posts on Scubaboard than dives. Constructive discussion is always easier to take than misplaced judgement.

I like to dive, it's fun, but not worth dying for.

 

[Rick Murchison]

... I find it particularly amusing when many of the people so certain of their opinions have more posts on Scubaboard than dives...

Hmmm... leseee here... 500-999 dives; 754 posts since joining in 2006... you may soon be in a position to regret that statement
Rick (with way more posts than dives)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Let me take just one parting shot. I'm NOT convinced that technical diving is insurance against anything bad happening to someone.

It is not. Many people who take technical training ignore the part of that training that focuses on critical thinking ... or they find someone who teaches a crappy class who never actually addresses that part.

Diving ... all styles and all levels ... requires critical thinking if the goal is to reduce your risks. That's really the point coming from those of us who have been objecting to some of the content on this and other deep air threads. Let's face it ... people have been diving deep air for decades. Many of those people are icons in the diving community, and have thousands of successful dives using those methods. What sets those people apart? Well, I think it's that they go into it with their eyes open. They've thought about the risks. They've paid their dues in the amount of training, practical experience, and thought they've put into their diving.

This is very different from what I've seen being promoted in this and other threads ... where deep air is being talked about as a shortcut to training, or to the "expense" of helium. People who do successful deep air dives aren't looking for shortcuts. They're working their way up to those dives. They're using similar skills and knowledge as their trimix counterparts when it comes to a comprehension of decompression theory and practice. They're making use of their ability to adapt by making successively more aggressive dives.

What they're NOT doing is justifying why appropriate training, equipment and skills are not needed because "everybody's doing it".

That's what I find objectionable ... not the fact that people are going deep on air, but rather how and why they're doing it.

It appears that those who are involved in technical diving increase their task loading and add several levels of complexity to diving. Switching tanks and long deco periods mean being below water for very long stretches. The people who I have known who are involved in technical diving get very excited at first but then do little technical diving and end up selling their equipment.

From what I have seen, many of the people who get into tech diving do not spend enough time actually diving deep to be proficient, yet they do complicated dives with more confidence. It is that confidence in tech diving that is just as problematic or more than diving deep on air (within limits).

If you should ever decide to take a deep air class from one of the agencies that teaches it I think you'll be surprised to learn that they teach many of the same techniques that the agencies using trimix do. Deep air IS technical diving ... with the added complication of narcosis management. You still have the same levels of task loading, and unless you're carrying oxygen enriched decompression gasses you're going to have even longer deco periods to deal with. You still have to know how to manage your gas supply, and how to factor in what you will need to reserve for deco and emergencies. Just because the gas on your back doesn't include helium doesn't make the risks any less, or the dive any less complex. In some ways a deep air dive is harder to manage than one involving trimix. That's really rather the point ... it's not a shortcut at all. What it also isn't, or shouldn't be ... but what it amounts to for many ... is a leap of faith.

I don't think it is constructive to be so flipant as to say "that should be tech diving" as if that is really an answer.

But it really IS the answer. Once you go below recreational depths your risks go beyond what recreational training prepares you for. Once you accue a decompression obligation, you are doing a tech dive ... whether you want to or not. Don't you think it would be a neat idea to have a clue what that means?

I find it particularly amusing when many of the people so certain of their opinions have more posts on Scubaboard than dives.

Over the past 10 years I've averaged about 280 dives per year. I'd love to be able to match my dive count to my post count ... but the reality is that I can read and contribute to about a dozen threads in the time it typically takes me to prepare for and execute a single dive. Posting opinions means nothing ... developing a context for those opinions underwater does.

Constructive discussion is always easier to take than misplaced judgement.

Then perhaps you should go back to post #4 in this thread and start over ... because to date it remains the most constructive commentary you've received here.

I like to dive, it's fun, but not worth dying for.

I agree ... on both counts ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[TSandM]

I like to dive, it's fun, but not worth dying for.

I have to shake my head at this statement from someone who thinks there's nothing wrong with going to 200 feet on a small, single tank of gas . . .

 

[VooDooGasMan]

TS&M I'm sure many shook there head when you posted a dive, that you were already into the dive and realized the tank was depleted and did a short dive anyways. how is that different, always start with a full tank.

 

[PfcAJ]

Start the dive with enough gas to complete your dive and have an adequate reserve. Full or not doesn't really matter.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

TS&M I'm sure many shook there head when you posted a dive, that you were already into the dive and realized the tank was depleted and did a short dive anyways. how is that different, always start with a full tank.

Well, among other things Lynne knows how to look at her gauge and calculate how many cubic feet of gas is in it at any given pressure. She knows how to calculate, at any given pressure, how deep and for how long she can go and still have acceptable reserves to complete the ascent without undue time constraints. She knows how much reserve she needs at any given depth to deal with a worst-case emergency. And she knows how to adjust her dive profile for unexpected circumstances.

The key word is "knows".

I often start a dive without a full tank ... or more specifically without two full tanks. Those of us who dive doubles recreationally will commonly get two or more dives out of a full set. The key isn't some slogan ... it's knowing before you get in the water how much gas you'll likely use for the dive you're planning to do, and how much you need to reserve for emergencies. For divers who possess that knowledge, you're going into the dive with the tools to plan your profile accordingly.

NWGratefulDiver.com

... Bob (Grateful Diver)