Diver Attrition

[MikeFerrara]

When we were working on a standards rewrite for one of the major agencies we tried to insert a clause requiring that there be, at a minimum, one confined water session (prior to going to open water) in the same full gear that would be used in open water. This recommendation was rejected by the agency as “non-competitive” since it would make their courses more expensive.

I think the idea is good but there is a reason that it wouldn't have worked for us and it had nothing to do with competing.

First, some of the pools we used were just too watm to put some students in two piece 7 mil suits. Second, the pool really does ruin a wet suit in a hurry.

On the other hand we used other pools that were pretty chilly and some students needed exposure protection...I know that I sure did.

What we used to do is start OW weekends with a session in shallow pool like OW conditions with the sole purpose of getting them weighted, trimmed and acclimated. Only then did we start OW training dive 1. If it took an hour and a tank of air, then that's what it took but I wasn't taking any one out diving until it was done.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I think this is a very important point. Many of the OW courses I've observed while at quarries have a very rushed "let's get this done and get home" feel to them.

In contrast, I was able to observe Ber and some of her students at the last GLWC M&G. I'm not sure if it was an OW class, AOW class or a combination. Regardless, I was very impressed with the time she took with the students, the laid back non-rushed feel to what I witnessed and to the general tone which communicated that even quarry diving is fun. And that was in late April when the temps were 42-50!

Both a kudo to Ber and an editorial comment that, in my mind, this is the tone a class should set. Not the typical "yea, I know quarry diving sucks but lets get this done and go home so that everyone can go dive in Florida" tone most classes that I've seen have.

IMO most scuba instructors don't even look like they enjoy diving! That's a problem.

I agree. Ber is one of the VERY few instructors that I would recommend. I've known her since she was just a little diver...not even an instructor yet and I wouldn't think twice about sending a friend ot loved one to her.

 

[moonmaeven]

My husband & I did a "resort dive" 3 years ago, and wanted to get certified for our vacation this summer. Our original intent was to just be able to dive while on vacation.

Just before I was to take do the O/W cert dives I found out that I was pregnant, and could not continue. I was able to convince my husband to finish the class and then secretly signed him up for the advanced class as well. He really loves the sport (and has even talked about diving locally as opposed to only on vacation), but hasn't gone diving again (about 2 months) because he doesn't have his dive buddy (me) and he doesn't want to dive with anyone else... this was supposed to be for us to do together. We leave for Jamaica in 2 weeks, and I've got my fingers crossed that I'll find someone at our resort that he will trust enough to buddy up with.

He really loves it, and honestly I can't wait to have the baby so that I can finish up my certification too... but now family committments will get in the way. It's highly unlikely that we'll be able to afford a day-long babysitter every time we want to go diving because we will have to rent equipment, too... With a baby on the way, we aren't buying our eq like we had originally planned -- we now have a nursery to setup.

So although we have the best of intentions, we may find ourselves part of the attrition rate simply out of necessity... at least for the next few years.

 

[Thalassamania]

Mike,

It does not sound like you were the kind of folks we were aiming that standard at. Clearly there had to be some sanity and we did exempt things like hoods (though we suggested gloves). Our experience was that pool chlorine was not as hard on gear as many folks claim, heck it's the only time some of my gear gets really clean<G>.

And as far as temp is concerened, you're right if the temp is much above 80, forget it, but competition pools should all be cooler than that, it's just instructional and aqua-aerobics pools that are typically warmer. What pool(s) did you have temperature problems with? I'd bet is was the "Y."<G>

 

[LowVizWiz]

there is a diving activity gap that seems to be associated with the assumption of responsibility, both financial and family, that inhibits diving temporarily, or permanently, during the normal maturing process within our society.
,

I guess I'm outside the "normal maturing process", I always wanted to dive. Grew up watching[SIZE=-1]Jacques[/SIZE] Cousteau and that is partially the reason I work in the TV industry now. However, not up until the last few years I have had enough disposable income to make diving a reality. I also guess that's the difference for me it's more of a life long dream than a spurr of the moment desicion.

I have 2 kids (daughter seven and son two years old) and married happily. I'm 35 going on 18

My wife does not like the outdoors at all as she wilts in the FL sunshine in no time flat, but she likes to vacation so even tho she currently is not interested in diving she's interested on those liveaboard trips I keep reading about!

I do concurr, that most people who get certified are younger (early to mid 20s), but the dive boats are filled with mid 30 and older people. So the gap seems to be real.

Wys.

 

[LowVizWiz]

Do it on faith for a while, and you'll reach a day when you are under there and you are flying, and you will know why you stuck with it.

You make a great point, I remember my first dive. It was a beach entry wearing a weigth belt with more weight than I ever needed, the surf ripped my mask off never to be seen again. I literally crawled out of the water with sand in every orifice in my body!

Very smooth!

Every now and then I wake up in cold sweat just thinking about it.:11:

Wys.

 

[Darnold9999]

Interesting thread. I was one of those that dropped diving for a number of years. Went through a very thorough course - many weeks then dove for three or four years, but finally gave it up. Realized that this sport was way too difficult and expensive for its rewards at the time.

In the winter the vis is great, but it is damn cold when you get out. In the summer you parbroil before getting in the water and the vis sucks. Boat diving worked, if you owned a boat - no such thing as a dive charter. Wet suits are fine until you get to about 90 feet or so - at that point you may as well be wearing a T shirt. At the end of the day it just wasn't worth it to spend half a day and a bunch of $ to either freeze to death or cook to death for 40 min or so in murky water. So I gave up cold water diving entirely and didn't dive for five years or so until I was taking winter vacations when I started diving pretty much 4 - 5 times a year for the next 10 or so years in warm water.

Something changed last year. Went to Australia, dove the GBR on a liveaboard - got the bug again. Bought a dry suit, all new gear and a camera and have put 60 cold water dives and the same again on warm water dives in the past 9 months.

What has changed? Don't really know. The dry suit makes cold water diving, if not comfortable, a lot more comfortable than a wetsuit so I don't feel I am working quite so hard to have fun. I can afford the charters and liveaboards - 20 years ago - not so much - so relatively it is not as expensive a sport as it was then.

The internet has helped. Finding someone to dive with is WAY easier. Just post a notice someone is always looking to dive.

No point to all of this, except that as a young person I wanted the thrill of the dive, but couldn't really afford to dive given all of the other demands on my time and $. I suspect that is a large part of what happens. Diving not only takes a significant amount of money it takes a huge amount of time. In this world of instant gratification diving just doesn't cut it for most.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Mike,

It does not sound like you were the kind of folks we were aiming that standard at. Clearly there had to be some sanity and we did exempt things like hoods (though we suggested gloves). Our experience was that pool chlorine was not as hard on gear as many folks claim, heck it's the only time some of my gear gets really clean<G>.

Don't get me wrong, I think your idea was sound. The addition of heavy exposure protection needs to be addressed somehow by the instructor prior to just taking folks out diving. Whether pool or "confined open water" works best kind of depends on the situation.

And as far as temp is concerened, you're right if the temp is much above 80, forget it, but competition pools should all be cooler than that, it's just instructional and aqua-aerobics pools that are typically warmer. What pool(s) did you have temperature problems with? I'd bet is was the "Y."<G>

The only pool that I ever really remember being too warm was a high school pool that we used during part of the year. The water was very warm but the air temp was sometimes just plain hot. Of course, summer here brings HOt outside temps and surface temps in excess of 80 deg F but you still have to content with heavy exposure protection if you're diving to nay depth because it will be cold there.

Other pools that we used were cold and all but the biggest and most hot blooded students needed wet suits just to stay in the water. There was one pool that we used that was down in a valley near a river. The water was usually cool but the air could be really cold at night even in the summer. I myself used a two piece 7 mil suit to be able to stay in for between two and three hours.

Chlorine damage...My equipment, including wet suits always lost it's color fairly quick but I was in the water almost every day. Our student BC's which started out black are all an ugly shade of brown but everything still works. LOL

 

[slackercruster]

I guess I'm outside the "normal maturing process", I always wanted to dive. Grew up watching[SIZE=-1]Jacques[/SIZE] Cousteau and that is partially the reason I work in the TV industry now. However, not up until the last few years I have had enough disposable income to make diving a reality. I also guess that's the difference for me it's more of a life long dream than a spurr of the moment desicion.

I have 2 kids (daughter seven and son two years old) and married happily. I'm 35 going on 18

My wife does not like the outdoors at all as she wilts in the FL sunshine in no time flat, but she likes to vacation so even tho she currently is not interested in diving she's interested on those liveaboard trips I keep reading about!

I do concurr, that most people who get certified are younger (early to mid 20s), but the dive boats are filled with mid 30 and older people. So the gap seems to be real.

Wys.

The only barrier with old age is the barrier of trying new stuff. On a recent boat trip 8 out of 10 were over 50. My problem is money and lack of local dive spots. If I had excess money I could travel to the spots whereas my local spots are murky or the pool.

 

[slackercruster]

Thanks for all the words of support. I know I was overweighted for the OW cert dives at 40lbs for the fresh water and 50 lbs for the ocean. I was not going to do a repeat of the lake dive weighting show at the ocean so I just threw in another 10lbs and toughed it out.

I bought my own semi-wet Xcel Tri-density and took off 5 lbs for it. Using the 10% of body weight plus 10 lbs I'm still coming in at around 35 lbs + 5 for the AL80 = 40 So I was probably 5 lbs over for my last dive. My BC will hold 20 in ditchable pockets so I kept the other 25 on a belt -- which drives me nuts. I'm looking at buying a steel tank and getting a weight harness to eliminate the dive belt and shed another 10 lbs which shood put in the 30 lbs of lead range. With experience and some work, I may be able to shed a bit more.

Doc, it's funny you should mention skiing. I love that sport too and it was one of the major thoughts that I turn to when i start getting irritated at my clumsiness as a new diver. It took me 20 years and quite a few lessons for me to feel comfortable skiing some of the hardest runs in the West. I have to keep reminding myself it took me 3 ski trips before i could get off the chair without falling.

Again -- thanks for the encouragement. I have learned a lot from the experienced folks on this board and am always amazed at how much information and concern is shown by the community here.

Yes, I love skibaords (short center mount twin tip symmetrical skis under 99 cm.) Took me a while to find the right setup. I started with mini skis (Snowblades) and poles from my skiing background. Then once I tried true center mount skiboards anjd lost the poles I was hooked...especially for riding fakie. Scuba gear will be in storage late fall and snow gear comes out. Seamless transitions are best.