Do you actually see people diving with pony bottles?

[Anthony Jones]

I didn't own a tank until I got into technical diving. I was then an instructor. None of the dozen or so instructors in the shop where I worked at the time owned tanks. I would guess that only a handful of them had ever even seen anything other than a rental AL 80, which is what probably 80% of the world's divers use.

I'd bet you are right. A decade ago when I had a real job and had to do adult stuff every day, I swore I'd never buy a $400 tank and have the maint. and fees for hydro/vis when I could just rent one at the shop for five bucks. For some reason, it cost me the same to get my tank filled as it does to rent their full tank. Tank rental (full) is five bucks per day. Cost me five to fill mine (air). Go figure. So the math just didn't work. Then I started diving 3 times a week and it just got too inconvenient diving around the dive shops hours. I like to throw my tanks on my boat and go when I want to.

For most "recreational" divers who dive 4 or 5 times a year it just makes more sense to rent.

 

[Marie13]

I'd say many recreational divers likely dive on vacation only, which makes owing tanks a non-issue.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I'd say many recreational divers likely dive on vacation only, which makes owing tanks a non-issue.

I'd go so far as to say "most," not "many."

 

[Lorenzoid]

I think it may be time to restate that there is a difference between diving with a pony in buddy dives or even in group guided dives and diving solo. I would never discourage any solo diver from the “inconvenience” of carrying a pony bottle. And one hopes if they are diving solo they have the experience and skills to manage the limited task loading and maintenance associated with pony bottles.

I hope I didn't imply otherwise. If one has taken a Solo course or otherwise gotten some training to dive solo, then they presumably understand all the pros and cons and have made the commitment--great. Throughout this thread, I have been focusing on the needs (real or perceived) of the average recreational diver, not divers who go solo, in reg-freezing conditions, etc.--I wholeheartedly agree that those kinds of dives are the niches that might benefit from a pony.

The original question was sort of a poll about whether we actually see people diving with ponies. I believe most of us do not see that, because most of us--especially outside of SB--constitute the "average recreational diver." Some of the pony use we do see might be by other average recreational divers who could probably make it easier on themselves using alternative means to improve their safety. Maybe this thread is another example of how SB isn't very representative of scuba diving in general. Yeah, we on SB probably see a lot more ponies out there than the average recreational diver.

 

[Coztick]

I think it may be time to restate that there is a difference between diving with a pony in buddy dives or even in group guided dives and diving solo.

When it comes to vacation divers, the instabuddy you have been paired with may or may not be competent.
If they are not, you find out that you are solo during the dive.
No thanks, not me, not ever!
I've personally enjoy and prefer the extra freedom of being the guides buddy. Once they see I'm competent, carry a pony and have training for redundant gas, I get to fly solo with the group.
Not that I can't be a good buddy, and will often position myself nearer to pairs that look less confident. But frankly, I find everything I see in the ocean extremely distracting and I do try to shoot a little video so I don't want to have to chase someone to be safe.

 

[Marie13]

I hope I didn't imply otherwise. If one has taken a Solo course or otherwise gotten some training to dive solo, then they presumably understand all the pros and cons and have made the commitment--great. Throughout this thread, I have been focusing on the needs (real or perceived) of the average recreational diver, not divers who go solo, in reg-freezing conditions, etc.--I wholeheartedly agree that those kinds of dives are the niches that might benefit from a pony.

The original question was sort of a poll about whether we actually see people diving with ponies. I believe most of us do not see that, because most of us--especially outside of SB--constitute the "average recreational diver." Some of the pony use we do see might be by other average recreational divers who could probably make it easier on themselves using alternative means to improve their safety. Maybe this thread is another example of how SB isn't very representative of scuba diving in general. Yeah, we on SB probably see a lot more ponies out there than the average recreational diver.

I guess it depends on where you dive. Or how observant you are.

I dive a local Midwestern quarry (Haigh, 90 min south of Chicago) that's not particularly deep (85ft in the "deep hole"; otherwise, 50-60ft on the deep side, 30ft at the most on the shallow side, aside from the "trench"), so you won't see people doing tech dives like you might at Gilboa (Ohio). Lots of OW/AOW classes usually from sometime in May through early September, although DRIS puts its students in drysuits, so they train in April and October. I see fair numbers of people diving SM and twinsets, getting time in the water, perhaps trainings/gear check dives before heading off to more challenging environments.

Haigh allows solo diving (unlike Mermet currently and Gilboa, beginning next year, I'm told), so perhaps that's why I see a lot of divers with ponies, in addition to instructors with them.

 

[uncfnp]

When it comes to vacation divers, the instabuddy you have been paired with may or may not be competent.
If they are not, you find out that you are solo during the dive.
No thanks, not me, not ever!
I've personally enjoy and prefer the extra freedom of being the guides buddy. Once they see I'm competent, carry a pony and have training for redundant gas, I get to fly solo with the group.
Not that I can't be a good buddy, and will often position myself nearer to pairs that look less confident. But frankly, I find everything I see in the ocean extremely distracting and I do try to shoot a little video so I don't want to have to chase someone to be safe.

Like most things in life it is a continuum in risk. Again, speaking for myself

In Florida I do a lot of true solo diving. Its just me and the ocean. And I push my conservative NDLS. I almost always carry a pony here.

Bonaire. I never carry one here although Eric does. I very rarely dive here without him. If I did I would borrow his, if I was going deeper or near my NDL. But the conditions are so benign and the risk so very small I wouldn’t otherwise.

Cozumel. So far we have not taken a pony but plan to next trip, or borrow one offered by a fellow SBer. We now dive with a shop that knows us and allows us a huge degree of dive freedom. So although we dive as buddies Eric or I, or both, will carry. As I said before. Eric is not the most situationally aware buddy.

For me it is probably more important then some. Let’s face it, the likelihood of an abrupt complete loss of gas is exceedingly unlikely so the risk of a cesa truly remote. More likely is a blown oring or such and this should allow most divers to make it to their buddy or safely to the surface. So then it is the question if you are comfortable diving without a safety stop. Anyone that knows my history knows that rapid ascents and missed safety stops are not a good idea.

 

[lowviz]

...//... Anyone that knows my history knows that rapid ascents and missed safety stops are not a good idea.

Risk management is a very personal thing. A pony is nothing more than another option.

Nicely stated scenarios...

 

[Marie13]

Like most things in life it is a continuum in risk. Again, speaking for myself

In Florida I do a lot of true solo diving. Its just me and the ocean. And I push my conservative NDLS. I almost always carry a pony here.

Bonaire. I never carry one here although Eric does. I very rarely dive here without him. If I did I would borrow his, if I was going deeper or near my NDL. But the conditions are so benign and the risk so very small I wouldn’t otherwise.

Cozumel. So far we have not taken a pony but plan to next trip, or borrow one offered by a fellow SBer. We now dive with a shop that knows us and allows us a huge degree of dive freedom. So although we dive as buddies Eric or I, or both, will carry. As I said before. Eric is not the most situationally aware buddy.

For me it is probably more important then some. Let’s face it, the likelihood of an abrupt complete loss of gas is exceedingly unlikely so the risk of a cesa truly remote. More likely is a blown oring or such and this should allow most divers to make it to their buddy or safely to the surface. So then it is the question if you are comfortable diving without a safety stop. Anyone that knows my history knows that rapid ascents and missed safety stops are not a good idea.

If I may ask, since you do mention it, what *is* your history?

 

[Lorenzoid]

PADI et al. should start teaching in the OW course that ponies are standard equipment, and then everyone in Cozumel will have one, and everyone will feel safer. It sounds like what PADI et al. currently teach is not safe enough.

The long primary hose still gets me weird looks now and then in various places around the world. (Some Coz DMs have them). I can only imagine what they would think about increasing numbers of visitors toting ponies.

The cynic in me says that if a pony were standard for every OW diver, we'd soon see a few divers insisting on sidemount, doubles, a rebreather or some such in Cozumel. (I have seen sidemounters there a couple of times.) One needs to appear safer than one's fellow diver, because one is not the "average" diver. We are all above average.