Does everyone really need an SPG? (w/transmitter)

[CosbySweater]

You gotta watch it when you make sweeping generalizations based on your own subjective and personal experiences.

What @CosbySweater wrote is simply not true. Several assumptions are made that don't follow a logical thought process.

I've got almost 500 dives on air integration, my buddy has 140, with no failures. So I could post that air integration is extremely reliable.

If your non-AI computer fails, you might have to abort the dive anyway depending on your no decompression limits, and you'd lose all your nitrogen and oxygen data from an extended dive trip (if applicable of course) and that applies to both air integrated and non air integrated setups.

I had a wrist receiver flood (I don't count this as an air integrated malfunction) and I continued the dive but stayed close to my buddy in the event that I would need to use their gas, but I always have a good idea of how much gas I have remaining so I can fairly accurately estimate dive time remaining. Worst case scenario my reg breathes hard at the safety stop and I cut the dive short and surface and attach my good old SPG that is currently sitting in my gear bag. I've had it on and off my first stage several times and finally decided not to bother with it anymore.

So a dive doesn't necessarily have to be aborted with a computer failure of any sort.

I too spend a lot of time underwater and I prefer to have all the information right there on my wrist without dragging an extra hose and set of gauges, it makes diving that much more enjoyable for me and if I HAD to abort a dive due to the extremely low possibility of an AI failure and no other option to extend the dive, it would still be worth it to lose one dive out of 100s in exchange for the convenience of wrist mounted AI.

TBH, the original question is silly. Everyone has different levels of risk they will accept on a particular dive. If an AI fails on a shallow dive, in good viz, at a familiar site, with a trusted buddy then it doesn't necessarily mean the dive should be aborted. It depends on the divers experience and comfort with the situation. My incident happened while I was solo drifting in relatively deep water. Had it not been for a backup gauge, the dive (and the day) would have been over for me. That's me though. Others may be different. I like to dive with redundancy for that reason though.

The issue with my Suunto transmitter is not exclusive to me. There are others (on SB no less) that have experienced the same issue with Suunto transmitters. So, the issue I highlighted extends beyond my personal experience so it's not a sweeping generalization. Yes, transmitters are reliable, but they have more potential points of failure than a simple SPG does. Redundancy is important to me and my config works for me. You dive you.

 

[M-Cameron]

i really dont see a good argument for not having redundant pressure/ depth/ time gauges....a pressure gauge/ a gshock/ and a depth meter can all be had for $150.....clip it off to a D-ring and dont worry about it.

if you computer or AI dies/ malfunctions mid dive......just dive tables......no need to abort your entire day of diving until you can get your computer fixed.

if you are concerned about "extra hoses"......keep the SPG group in your dive bag.....if your transponder dies, swap the transponder out with a spg on the boat.

 

[CanadaDan]

Can someone just make a transmitter with an analog SPG combo unit? Put it on a HP hose, clip it off and EVERYONE can just agree

 

[BoltSnap]

I had a wrist receiver flood (I don't count this as an air integrated malfunction) and I continued the dive but stayed close to my buddy in the event that I would need to use their gas, but I always have a good idea of how much gas I have remaining so I can fairly accurately estimate dive time remaining. Worst case scenario my reg breathes hard at the safety stop and I cut the dive short and surface and attach my good old SPG that is currently sitting in my gear bag. I've had it on and off my first stage several times and finally decided not to bother with it anymore.

So a dive doesn't necessarily have to be aborted with a computer failure of any sort.

This is sooo wrong and goes against ALL accepted and standard rules and instructions of computer use. It is very dangerous to play this game or to bring it up as if it were something normal or OK to do.

 

[BoltSnap]

if you computer or AI dies/ malfunctions mid dive......just dive tables......no need to abort your entire day of diving until you can get your computer fixed.

If you have been diving with a dive computer and doing multilevel diving, there is no way you can use dive tables immediately after a dive computer malfunction without sitting out of the water to offgas completely over a 24 hour period before you can go back into the water with dive tables or fresh dive computer. The advice you are giving is completely wrong and very dangerous.

 

[rsingler]

if you computer or AI dies/ malfunctions mid dive......just dive tables......no need to abort your entire day of diving until you can get your computer fixed.

So you had 3 min of NDL left on your computer when it died. It was your first afternoon dive (your third dive of the day). What's your PG (pressure group)? How long a surface interval are you going to use? How does the DSAT algorithm relate to the black box algorithm of your computer's first three dives? How are you going to adjust the table's NDL?

Seems to me that for some dives, that could be very dangerous advice you're giving.

 

[M-Cameron]

So you had 3 min of NDL left on your computer when it died. It was your first afternoon dive (your third dive of the day). What's your PG (pressure group)? How long a surface interval are you going to use? How does the DSAT algorithm relate to the black box algorithm of your computer's first three dives? How are you going to adjust the table's NDL?

Seems to me that for some dives, that could be very dangerous advice you're giving.

If you have been diving with a dive computer and doing multilevel diving, there is no way you can use dive tables immediately after a dive computer malfunction without sitting out of the water to offgas completely over a 24 hour period before you can go back into the water with dive tables or fresh dive computer. The advice you are giving is completely wrong and very dangerous.

yes, some critical thinking is required when you take any advice from the internet...that should be a given.

sure, if youve been doing multilevel dives for the past week, running right up to NDL each dive, and swapping between various Nitrox mixtures.....then yeah, you are SOL.....

however, if you are 3 mins into your first dive of the charter....you absolutely can run on tables......

or if youve been doing 30 min reef dives at 20-30 feet....you can go back, take your max depth for each dive and calculate your current pressure group.

and there is nothing "completely wrong" or "very dangerous" about doing that.

 

[BoltSnap]

yes, some critical thinking is required when you take any advice from the internet...that should be a given.

sure, if youve been doing multilevel dives for the past week, running right up to NDL each dive, and swapping between various Nitrox mixtures.....then yeah, you are SOL.....

however, if you are 3 mins into your first dive of the charter....you absolutely can run on tables......

or if youve been doing 30 min reef dives at 20-30 feet....you can go back, take your max depth for each dive and calculate your current pressure group.

and there is nothing "completely wrong" or "very dangerous" about doing that.

And you know that for certain with your extensive and very long one year diving experience?

You are VERY wrong and your BS is very dangerous! It is no less dangerous than put blindfold on your eyes and driving 100mph in your car for few seconds and saying it isn't dangerous because I only did it for few second not minutes. You know nothing and understand even less.

 

[M-Cameron]

And you know that for certain with your extensive and very long one year diving experience?

You are VERY wrong and your BS is very dangerous! It is no less dangerous than put blindfold on your eyes and driving 100mph in your car for few seconds and saying it isn't dangerous because I only did it for few second not minutes. You know nothing and understand even less.

in the 2 scenarios i listed.....what is "very wrong".....please explain in detail....inquiring minds would like to know

make a valid argument based on whats being said rather than trying to attack my "experience".

 

[gamon]

This is sooo wrong and goes against ALL accepted and standard rules and instructions of computer use. It is very dangerous to play this game or to bring it up as if it were something normal or OK to do.

@BurhanMuntasser your posts on this forum make it clear that you are the sort of person who thinks either people agree with you or they're wrong. I don't wear a snorkel either so that's strike #2 in your book. You must be one heck of an instructor with your "it's my way or the highway" perspective.

People have different diving styles. Is my style more risky or aggressive? Probably. Is it "wrong" because it isn't what most people do or isn't written in a manual somewhere or because it goes against your own personal beliefs?

No.

Safe diving.