Does size matter?

[Thalassamania]

Like most not-for profits (e.g., my wife works for the Visitiing Nurse Service and the've done this) there is "captive" for profit folded into the structure.

 

[knotical]

Is should be noted that PADI does not really have members, it has customers.

PADI calls us members and used that term in one of the quotations I cited. I simply defined the term for those not familiar with PADI's usage. You can call us whatever you want (within reason, hopefully).

 

[Thalassamania]

It's another piece of double speak. NAUI has members, members are discussed in it's bylaws and it's incorporation papers, members vote, the elect a BOD that runs the organization. PADI has client, or customers, or whatever you'd like to call them, who are only "members" in a sense that does minor violence to conventionally held meanings of that word.

If you shop at WalMart, you're not a member ... but if you shop at Costco you are ... so it's gotten a little confused I'll grant you.

 

[cflJason]

To answer the original question; my wife says yes

Is should be noted that PADI does not really have members, it has customers.

Now I have a question of my own about this. If PADI has "customers" and not "members" then why is it that we log into padimembers.com and not padicustomers.com?

 

[Thalassamania]

T... Now I have a question of my own about this. If PADI has "customers" and not "members" then why is it that we log into padimembers.com and not padicustomers.com?

For precisely the same reason that you refer to students who have done a skill once in the pool and stand not an ice cube's chance in hell of doing it again in open water as having, "mastered" said skill.

Well ... you did ask, didn't you?

 

[cflJason]

Well that's a great argument for why you state PADI has "customers" rather than "members" In other words your statement doesn't hold water, so you you need change the topic to bashing to lead away from the original flop. Classic!

I do agree that the ambiguous "mastery" of a skill is left up to the instructor, but that's the same no matter what agency you are with. Also, what is done in the pool is done in the open water dives with the exception of remove and replace of scuba unit and weights underwater.

Even if you had a committee of instructors to determine if somebody had "mastered" a skill, like you do for a dissertation, it's still subject to opinion. You can't escape it. Also, somebody can perform an action once and show mastery, or they can do it 20 times and mess it up each time. It all depends on the individual. If somebody can remove their regulator, retrieve it, put it back in their mouth, clear it, and resume breathing like they did it 100 times before, do I really need to watch them do it 100 times before I get the idea that they can do this well?

 

[Thalassamania]

Well that's a great argument for why you state PADI has "customers" rather than "members" In other words your statement doesn't hold water, so you you need change the topic to bashing to lead away from the original flop. Classic!

Sorry, I guess your too lost in the forest to see the trees, they're basically the same. PADI has a long history of redefining words to suit their own advertising those were just two examples and if you failed to see the connection and instead saw it as a "change in topic" that goes to your lack of discernment, not to my intent.

I do agree that the ambiguous "mastery" of a skill is left up to the instructor, but that's the same no matter what agency you are with. Also, what is done in the pool is done in the open water dives with the exception of remove and replace of scuba unit and weights underwater.

Even if you had a committee of instructors to determine if somebody had "mastered" a skill, like you do for a dissertation, it's still subject to opinion. You can't escape it. Also, somebody can perform an action once and show mastery, or they can do it 20 times and mess it up each time. It all depends on the individual. If somebody can remove their regulator, retrieve it, put it back in their mouth, clear it, and resume breathing like they did it 100 times before, do I really need to watch them do it 100 times before I get the idea that they can do this well?

As to mastery ... do a search and resurrect a zombie thread, we did that one long ago, and there's no need to hijack this one, since your clear lack of familiarity with the literature concerning the kenesiology of diver education makes it clear that you are ill prepared for a dialectic on the subject that would shed any light.

 

[cflJason]

Sorry, I guess your too lost in the forest to see the trees, they're basically the same. PADI has a long history of redefining words to suit their own advertising those were just two examples and if you failed to see the connection and instead saw it as a "change in topic" that goes to your lack of discernment, not to my intent.

As to mastery ... do a search and resurrect a zombie thread, we did that one long ago, and there's no need to hijack this one, since your clear lack of familiarity with the literature concerning the kenesiology of diver education makes it clear that you are ill prepared for a dialectic on the subject that would shed any light.

No need for me to hijack this thread, you did that the second you started your bash-capade.

As far as hijacking words, every company that has a competent marketing department does it. Have you noticed how a lot of words have even been created from it? Synergy comes to mind. What the heck does that mean anyways. Or incentivise (got to love it). But point in fact your still avoiding answering where you get the notion that PADI has customers and not members. In fact, every PADI dive master or higher is considered a member, pays dues, receives literature, etc.

P.S. Glad to see you figured out how to work the thesaurus feature in your MS Word

 

[Thalassamania]

You see accurate analysis and justified criticism as bashing. BUt the ... that's to be expect since your background in semantics is more than a bit weak.

Synergy (from the Greek syn-ergos, συνεργός meaning working together) is the term used to describe a situation where different entities cooperate advantageously for a final outcome. Simply defined, it means that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. The essence of synergy is to value differences.

Syngergy first arose in 1660 with the simple meaning "cooperation".

Pay attention ... you might jsut learn something.

And I do not use MS Word, I use Open Office.

 

[Walter]

PADI "members" have no vote. They are members, but there's no difference between their status and the status they would have if they were called customers. NAUI and SEI have members who actually get to vote to determine the future of the agencies. Members of NAUI and SEI can actually run for the board which sets policy. That's the difference. I believe PADI "members" lost those membership perks over 20 years ago, effectively converting them from "members" to "customers" although the terminology did not change.