General Vortex Incident Discussion

[ucfdiver]

And James, he's referring to me. You got left out since you dive SM

You know, I thought that, but then he says this-

... I'm referring to the person who keeps insisting that side-mount is for cave diving only ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Which basically states my opinion. I'm not sure what he's trying to say, unless he hand selects people from that opinion base to prove his point.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

You know, I thought that, but then he says this-


Which basically states my opinion. I'm not sure what he's trying to say, unless he hand selects people from that opinion base to prove his point.

You're entitled to your opinion. You're wrong ... of course ... but you're entitled to it anyway ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[PfcAJ]

James is so wrong in his opinion that its the one without a body count on it.

 

[ucfdiver]

You're entitled to your opinion. You're wrong ... of course ... but you're entitled to it anyway ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Just enjoying your blatant hand picking to prove your point.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

James is so wrong in his opinion that its the one without a body count on it.

I bow to your greater experience ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Just enjoying your blatant hand picking to prove your point.

I don't need to prove anything ... fortunately you don't decide how I, or anybody else, gets to dive ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[ucfdiver]

I don't need to prove anything ... fortunately you don't decide how I, or anybody else, gets to dive ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Or unfortunately in Ben's case. Actually the IUCRR is full of cases....deep air, rebreather when it wasn't needed, visual jumps, solo diving, etc.

But let's not state the obvious. Let's stand around and give each others warm and fuzzies. We're only getting about 5-10 body recoveries in caves a year, nbd, right?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Or unfortunately in Ben's case.

Do you really believe that there was anything you could do or say that would have prevented him from making his own choices? I don't.

You two guys are showing an amazing degree of idealism believing that you have the ability to somehow impact someone else's behavior ... particularly with the "certainty" you have in the way you deliver your answers. The reality is that you have less impact than you should have, because your arrogance causes people to stop listening to what you have to say ... even people like me, who would otherwise be inclined to agree with you.

The reality of human behavior is far from what you believe it to be. Give it another 20 years or so and you'll begin to realize why.

Ben didn't die due to inadequate training ... he died due to inadequate judgment. That's not something you can "fix" ... only he could've done that.

Sometimes you just gotta let Darwin take his due ... it's how we keep from breeding a race of idiots ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[ucfdiver]

Do you really believe that there was anything you could do or say that would have prevented him from making his own choices? I don't.

Well, the light rule in state parks seem to be doing very well. Sometimes we can't change opinions, but we can remove opportunity.

 

[PfcAJ]

We have a fundamental disagreement not so much on scuba, but on if people's judgement can be fixed. I think it can be fixed, you think it can't. I think a high level of training (actual training, not this faux training we talk about a lot) can greatly influence a person's decision making.

But I'm sure when I'm older I'll see it your way, at least thats what you usually say when we argue about stuff on here.