LDS loyalty or cost effectiveness

[Beboandles]

just read another thread about someone dumping their lds for bad treatment....

my question is how far do you carry the lsd loyalty?
My situation is that I live in a town with only 2 major lds's.I have purchased approx $2700 with alot more to go(trying to outfit 2 divers)from one of the lds's.Let me make it clear that they are very nice and helpful but I recently went to another lds because I found that I had other options(brands)to look at.On top of that I have seen great reviews on some of the online companies as well(scubatoys)and have looked at prices that of items that I have already bought and see the savings would have been large.
I did feel that items that needed to be fitted would be best bought locally but I am now wondering about some other equipement that does not need fitting.
Once again I beleive in supporting lds"s but where is the line drawn?
1) do you stick with one and only purchase the brands they sell?
2) would you look at other lds to see different brands?
3) would it be wrong to get the much better deal on line with a reputable shop such as scubatoys?
4) most importantly, is it wrong if I buy a piece of equipment on line that my lds services and than expect them to service?
thanks for you opions!

 

[Brandon]

1) do you stick with one and only purchase the brands they sell?

No. I research what I want and find a shop that sells it. No reason to buy a product that I don't want just because that's all my LDS sells.

2) would you look at other lds to see different brands?

Yes, if one LDS doesn't have it, I'll look at another or online for what I want.

3) would it be wrong to get the much better deal on line with a reputable shop such as scubatoys?

Not really, but most would try to give their LDS a shot at price matching first.

4) most importantly, is it wrong if I buy a piece of equipment on line that my lds services and than expect them to service?

As long as you have a full manufacturer's warranty, go for it. They might say no, but most likely will be happy to at least get the service business on the gear.

It is wrong (in the moral sense), to use your LDS as a "fitting room", only to turn around and order the product online. You don't have a moral requirement to be loyal to your shop, but you shouldn't use them to get information about a product if you don't intend to buy it from them.

Demand good customer service, but treat your shop fairly as well.

my question is how far do you carry the lsd loyalty?

My answer is probably fairly clear - I don't really believe in being loyal to any specific retail outlet. There are some stores that I would prefer to do business with over others, and some that I won't shop with unless I don't have a choice... but ultimately it comes down to who has the best price on the item I want, and who makes it easiest for me to do business with them.

Larry at Scubatoys gets most of my online business - because he has great prices, is very friendly, and has worked with me on shipping to Alaska.

Leisurepro gets some of my online business - because they have a huge selection and its hard to beat some of their prices. If I'm in Alaska, I won't order from them - because their shipping rates are insane. I won't order anything major from them, because I like real warranties. I also think they're rude, and generally a pain to deal with.

My local dive shop (Test the Waters) gets very little of my business - because they are rude, pushy, have high prices, poor selection, and I feel harassed whenever I'm in their shop. I'll rent a tank, or get an air fill there every now and then. They lost over $5000 in gear purchases because of their attutude.

Eugene Skin Divers will see some of my business when I move to Oregon - because I like the way I was treated when I was browsing in their shop, they had a good selection, and didn't seem pushy.

I'll always dive with B&B Scuba when I'm on Maui - because I like the laid-back feel, and their shop employees are very friendly. Their charter scheduling times work out real well for me too.

If I'm looking for something specific, I might duck into Maui Dive Shop - but unlikely to make any major purchases there. They have a pretty good selection, and lots of locations... hard to say much more about them.

I don't know how many divers stick to just one LDS, I doubt very many. I'm not going to put up with high prices, bad service, or poor selection to stay loyal to one shop. I'm still the consumer - and I should be able to buy whatever I want, from whomever I want. If the shop wants my business, they need to cater to my needs - it's not the other way around.

-Brandon.

 

[Chaseh]

How about just live in a capitalistic fashion. Buy what you need where you're most comfortable buying it (service) and get the best deal (price).

I wouldn't take it so far to try on wet suits at my LDS and then walk out and order online, but I break it up. Items I am comforable buying sight unseen, especially when the LDS doesn't carry the brand, I buy online (with great service from ST).

Items I want more personal service on, I'll buy at my LDS and pay more for it. Plus, in NVA we have a few to choose from.

Also, I'll pick up a few toys at the friendly LDS while stopping in for service or whatnot.

Doesn't have to be one or the other.

 

[LSDeep]

hey, i am willing to talk with my lds about it before i buy somewhere else (i even work for them ). but generally i dont overpay them for stuff i can get substantially cheaper elsewhere. i believe in a good relationship with a lds, but i will not take it to losing serious money, i dont mind to pay a bit more (most ppl forget about the s&h cost if they order online). in exchange i expect friendly service, quality recommandations (dont try to push the most expensive - maybe great - piece in the shop on me i dont need). your lds should be friendly (sure they run a biz also), objective and open to your needs and recommend products on that base. you might have a certain brand in mind, there might be sth equal or better for the same price or cheaper - so listen to it.
you shouldnt consider any lds your lds just because it is around the corner. "your" lds will apprechiate you as client and guest and sometimes even give you tips where to get what you need, even if they dont have it.
in the end, use common sense! having worked many years in this biz, i used sometimes to send ppl to other shops. the amazing thing is, they come back to you! its just the highly apprechiated feeling not to talk to a "used car salesman" but somebody who cares about your needs!

 

[Talon]

1) do you stick with one and only purchase the brands they sell?

No. You only short change yourself with that mentality. Would you only buy a Ford because you first car was a Ford. Heck no... your taste and needs change. Just because your normal LDS doesn't carry what you need or want, doesn't mean you should limit yourself. Heck, if nothing else... Ask them and see if they can order it for you.

2) would you look at other lds to see different brands?

Yes. Would you shop more then one car lot? Heck, LDS would rather lose a sale to another LDS then a online reseller. The one thing they all have in common is they hate on-line resellers

3) would it be wrong to get the much better deal on line with a reputable shop such as scubatoys?

Here is where it gets a little tricky and a personal choice. Is it wrong??? Strictly speaking... NO!!!! It is your money, you can spend it where ever YOU want. Don't EVER let a LDS make you feel guilty. But there are two sides to the story - there are obvious advantages to shopping at your LDS. First, you get to inspect the gear right there and ask questions. There is also the immediate satisfaction of not having to wait for it to show up in the mail. And yes, it does help to support your LDS. There is some truth to the fact that we need them to stay in business.

Here is where I draw the line - if they can get within 10% of the price on major purchases I can get on-line, I will buy from them. But if not, I will shop on-line. Why should I pay out the nose just to support the poor business model the scuba industry enforces on the LDS (on some brands they are restricted on cost - but there ARE ways around it). Here is an example - I just bought a new dive computer. Retail was $479 and I got it for $300 from an on-line reseller. My LDS couldn't even get close.

4) most importantly, is it wrong if I buy a piece of equipment on line that my lds services and than expect them to service?
thanks for you opions!

No... or at least I don't think so. First of all, I don't point it out. They may remember if you bought it from them, they may not. But they don't know if you bought it from another LDS or on-line. My local LDS services some of my gear that I bought on-line and they have NEVER said anything to me. Partially becasue I never bring it up. These guys HATE on-line resellers. Don't even bring the subject up in their store. They go into a rage From their pespective also: so the lost the sell, but at least they make the money on the service. At least they are getting a taste.

 

[The Kraken]

My loyalty lies in my wallet and my fiduciary responsibility to my family.

the K

 

[DBailey]

1) do you stick with one and only purchase the brands they sell?

No. However, I will ask my favorite shop if they can order the item. Sometimes they can get the item, sometimes they can not.

2) would you look at other lds to see different brands?

Yes, if I need to see the item. Most of the time the internet, Scubaboard and dive magazines will give me all the information I need.

3) would it be wrong to get the much better deal on line with a reputable shop such as scubatoys?

For me ScubaToys is the exception to the rule. They follow the manufacturers' online policies. However, if you frequent a small shop, more than likely they will know what you bought there and what you did not. Depending on the shop, you will get benefits as you buy stuff from them. Is the savings from the internet worth the potential intangible benefits from your LDS?

4) most importantly, is it wrong if I buy a piece of equipment on line that my lds services and than expect them to service?

Nothing wrong with it; however, make sure that the manufacturer allows online sales. If they don't you might be paying more. Also, the shop has the right to refuse service. Just like you have the right not to buy stuff there.

 

[Meng_Tze]

My loyalty lies in my wallet and my fiduciary responsibility to my family.

the K

Hear, Hear!!

 

[farrakhan]

Yawn, another lds slagging post. Because LDS are as different to each other as apples and oranges I always find it humourous that these posts are so popular. If your mistreated at your lds then by all means go elsewhere but please don't assume that all lds are like that.

And remember like "The Kracken" dive shop owners loyalty can also lay in thier wallets and thier fiduciary responsibility to thier families.

 

[underachiever]

The dive shop we are supporting right now is the only one in the imediate area. We pruchased a "dive team" membership and get 10% off all merchandise. We actually got our money back with the discount on the OWC and our Fin, snorkel, etc.. package.
Not to say that we possibly could have negoiated the price anyway.

How much more negotiating room is there on most products? I do not mind paying the online price, plus shipping, plus a little more. But will most shops find a happy medium between online prices and retail. There prices do seem a little high. But it also seems like they only carry the middle of the lines and up. So what I may be comparing to may be low end stuff. I still need to educate mysely on product lines I'm sure. The LDS is very quick to point out that if I do not like a product that they will exchange it. I think this will mean a lot. We are very early on in this addition and can see $5000+ going into it fairly quickly. So 10-25% off could end up paying for a trip. Plus I enjoy dikering (sp) anyway.

Another possibility is used equipment. This LDS replaces there rental gear or the gear used for instruction yearly and has a tent sale selling the used gear for 50% of the origional price. Of course ther are some items I will want new. But does anyone have any experience on a dive shop that does this and can these prices be improved on. Actually we just missed out on the "tent sale" but there are some items remaining but not sure what. Hope to check that out tonight.
ANother option for this dive shop is to pay 50% down on and item and then rent "MY" equipment when I need it until it is paid for. All rental fees going toward the origional purchase price. No interest or addons.

The more I sit here and write the more that I think these guys are really trying. Especially if I can work em down a "little" on the prices.

Just my 2 cents. and I am very new to this sport. Only a week into it.