Learning from the military

[Skydiver1]

Hi all,

Just watched a few documentaries on youtube detailing combat diving courses. Here's a link to one of the videos

[video=youtube;8chYwSIXSv0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8chYwSIXSv0&feature=g-vrec[/video]


Some of the exercises involved "drown proofing" where candidates have feet and hands tied, and have to "bob" up and down several times before completing a 50 meter swim with hands and feet tied. Also includes a 50 meter underwater swim, performing surface checks for 5 minutes with no air in the BC, having regulator hoses tied by instructors underwater continuously inducing a hypoxic state, etc. (Also interestingly they seem to opt for buddy breathing instead of having an donatable octo)

Is such training available for civilian divers? I realise that the tasks are more grueling, dangerous and thus probably require alot more support staff. That means alot more cost. Do you think such training would be of benefit in preventing panic and instilling water confidence, learning to work through problems underwater, etc.

 

[fnfalman]

I'd only be interested in the training if I were to get to wear a Glock.

 

[Teller]

The training is available and its free. Visit your local Army Recruiting Station.

 

[Rich Keller]

You are not going to find that kind of course anywhere. The buddy breathing you saw was how it was done before there were octos and can still be of use today but no one teaches that anymore. The drown proofing is not as hard as it looks but again no one is going to teach it to that extreme. If you are interested I can give you a basic overview of how these techniques can be practiced.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Not true as far as buddy breathing. I still teach it in every OW course and do it stationary, while swimming, and as an ascent exercise. In the AOW class it is done as a 100ft buddy breathing swim along a line, followed by an ascent. It is still taught in the SEI system for OW students.

 

[KD8NPB]

The 2 mile / 80 minute swim with jet or rocket fins is tough on the calves, I'll say that much.

 

[Skydiver1]

Thats what we did in BUDS, but I doubt given todays litigation climate, such a thing would ever be available to civilians...

But if you can make it through BUDS without ringing out, you can handle most any stress situation underwater (or above for that matter)...

I dont know about litigation, could you not argue the same about bringing people on training into caves. Is that not potentially more dangerous than having your regulator hose tied in 4 meters of water with safety divers observing you.

If passing BUDS confers and certifies that ability to resist panic, it would be valuable for civilians also.

 

[fnfalman]

Take up free diving training. Suddenly you realize that without mask, air, fins, weight belts or BC ain't that big of a deal.

 

[gitmo234]

I know two guys who went through that course. They were given a dive master card from NAUI upon completion. Neither one of them has used it because "diving can never be fun again"

 

[DevonDiver]

Is such training available for civilian divers? I realise that the tasks are more grueling, dangerous and thus probably require alot more support staff. That means alot more cost.

Not through any (liability conscious) training agency...

Those military courses have a number of prerequisites in support - most importantly direct medical supervision and immediate access to comprehensive and specialized medical treatment. That wouldn't be possible through a regular, or even exceptional, civilian dive center.

Also - the participants on the military courses have to pass a number of prerequisite medicals, fitness tests and other selections before they reach that stage. Those ensure medical and physical fitness, emotional stability and psychological robustness. It'd be virtual impossible to guarantee equal standards amongst civilian divers.

Do you think such training would be of benefit in preventing panic and instilling water confidence, learning to work through problems underwater, etc.

In the military context, they would help acclimatize the diver to stress and gas deprivation. However, they are also a selection tool - based on the assumption that a percentage of trainees won't have the psychological capabilities to deal with those stressors (thus fail).

There are already acceptable tests and procedures - at appropriate levels - in the recreational diver training program. There'd be no need to go all 'walter mitty' by instituting military style selections.

---------- Post added ----------

Take up free diving training. Suddenly you realize that without mask, air, fins, weight belts or BC ain't that big of a deal.

Start smacking a freediver in the guts, shoulder-barging them and slapping them upside the face whilst breath-holding ... and see how they get along