PADI training better than USN training?

[Fetch]

Bringing up the cyberseals.org link again?

I don't go for hero worship, but noone was denigrating the effing SEALs, so here goes a rephrase of John's statement:

A diver who is a cave 3/tech 3 instructor, and is also a rebreather diver, claimed that the general diving technique of SEALs, as witnessed by him, was not all that great - at approximately an Open Water level. He then went on to clarify that they weren't bad, that they just knew what they needed to get the job done. And that where they really shone was in killing you when they got out of the water.

This was a discussion of finning, bouyancy, and trim. And keep in mind that the videos of excellent bouyancy trim and finning techniques on the fifthd site were done by Open Water students of AG's... nowhere was the "typical" PADI level stated or implied.

You may now return to your regularly scheduled hero worship.

jeff

100days-a-year once bubbled...
Gosh Walter,just as I was waiting for another "my Buddy'story you have to come along with facts and ruin itBTW all my experience with Navy divers while in the Navy was that they work awful hard at what they do ,I hate to see all that work denigrated.BTWII Navy SEAL stories are really checked here www.cyberseals.org has a list of poseurs.

 

[scubatexastony]

While on Treasure Island, and serving in the USN, I signed up for a NAUI scuba course being taught on the base by a couple Navy divers that happened to be Naui Instructors. There were several regular divers and some spouses that wanted to get certified, all in all, we had about 12 in the class.
Our combined classroom and pool work was three times a week, 4 hours each evening and lasted 6 weeks.
Generally, we started with 10 laps of the pool, snorkel only, to make us totally comfortable breathing maskless or flooded. Then there was equiptment, you could put it on/take it off in/out/under the water, bottom of the pool/surface. (My favorite was go to the bottom, gear up and surface cleared mask and breathing)
Bouyancy....ditto lots of work (what's a BC? weight right and BREATHE)
Swimming skills....did I mention 10 laps every class to start with, and then there was underwater Hockey, a full contact game, steel puck and wood sticks to push it along the bottom to the opponents wall, (I loved being a blocker, stuff the run-away to the bottom, GIRL? no problem...hehe)
We also went thru some Navy survival skills, making floats of any material available, basic rescue and self rescue.
Was it NAUI? Navy divers? I think I was just fortunate to have two good instructors that wanted their students to have a firm foundation and be safe divers.

My 2cw

tony

 

[Scubamedicjoe]

first I cannot belive the crap people write , yes I may not be able to spell right and use good crammer , but let me assure you the navy seals are trianed way the heck higher than any padi course out there , I can say this becuase my brothers one a navy seal active duty today and my other brother is a special forces diver who also went to diver school , first they not only learn the physics , and how to take and repaire there equipment but they go through a navication course that not many others would pass underwater much less on top of water , secoond once they finish there basic school mosst go on to a advance school wear they learn a heck allot more on rebrethers, mixed gas's and deep diving ect , please go ask some current miliitary divers first before you compare

 

[Mouth Breather old]

Medic MEDIC!!! SPELL CHECKER AND GRAMMAR CHECKER DOWN!!

Dude...my college roomie was from North Carolina so I'm pretty sure that they speak english there. Are you putting us on, or is your keyboard upsidedown? :tease:


Mouth Breather

 

[100days-a-year]

Fetch,Sorry if you misunderstood my point Jeff,but it was one of those anecdotal vs factual evidence things .I simply laughed about the"my buddy"who was a SEAL and couldn't dive well stories esp considering the guys were SEALs a long time ago.Walter gave a good blurb on what it takes to become a US Navy diver.As for the hero worship bit I don't understand what you meant.I stated stories about SF members will be researched by several members on this board if names are mentioned.Why you ask?Because some of us really get annoyed when people steal the respect and honor of ANY service member on the net because they can cowardly remain anonymous there.Still you gotta admit 100 dys of 8hr classes with an unlimited budget will probly be better than $200 and less than 40 hrs.

 

[Bob3]

The Navy has a couple of different diver training programs, one for combat swimmers (Seal/UDT) and the other for salvage/engineering, "working" type divers.

For what it's worth, some of the best trained "working" divers are turned out by the Chino State Prison, where there's no lack of time to devote to training programs.
Anybody up for a tour of the Chino dive school?
:mean:

 

[tchil01]

Bob3 once bubbled...
For what it's worth, some of the best trained "working" divers are turned out by the Chino State Prison, where there's no lack of time to devote to training programs.
Anybody up for a tour of the Chino dive school?
:mean:

Wow, now that's a school I would rather just vist then be enrolled in. Are dive knifes optional?

Ty

 

[otter-cat]

If I ever have to go to jail, I'll try to get myself into the Chino Prison work program as a diver! Could be better than my current job.

 

[rmediver2002]

Well I just finished reading through this thread...

Here is my imput:

There is really no way of comparing instruction by agency, so much is the instructors experience level, dedication, and motivation level... Even the best instructors at times get a little burned out.

As far as the Navy divers using horse coller BC's, the purpose is that they are the only type that will float a unconcious diver face up 100% of the time. This is a OSHA (see 29 and 46 CFR)requirement for commercial diving...

I for one would love to take a tour of the training facility at Chino, I saw an old documnetary on the program and thought the concept was fantastic... If I remember correctly the program was started by an ex-SEAL.

The biggest difference is really the mission of the divers when training is completed. In my observations and self analysis I have seen far better bouyancy control and trim adjustment from experienced recreationally trained divers. Military Deep Sea diving is commercial diving, often times the divers are walking on the bottom and most dives are conducted in zero visibility so stirring up any sediment is not an issue. The training is developed to ensure the divers can remain calm and be self sufficient in the event of a problem as the majority of dives will be conducted alone line tended to the surface. A big portion of the SCUBA training involves imposing problems on the divers on the bottom of a 15' deep pool were the instructors attempt to remove every piece of gear, especially air the diver does not maintain control of. The hits are restricted to 20 seconds and the instructors imposing them are on a breath hold. A safety diver remains with the student in the event of a problem and the student can and will take air from a safety diver if they can not regain and reset thier equipment. The military divers recieve far more training in diving medicine, physics, and physiology than recreationaly trained divers because they will be directly responsible for conducting decompression diving, surface decompression, and treatment of any diving injuries on a diving project. The fact that Naval training is conducted by a team of instructors who are not motivated by money or a requirement to pass a specific number of students but may at some point have to depend on the skills of the other divers on a project to help them provides a different type of instructor student relasionship than recreationl instruction. The students know this as well and have no doubt as to whether or not they earned the designation of diver... This same training concept applied to the training at Chino.

Another factor to consider is that most work is conducted surface supplied, SCUBA is not a prefered method of conducting commercial diving projects and decompression diving is not planned in SCUBA. A recreational diver who makes regular dives will most likely have more SCUBA dives than a military deep sea diver.

I have not taken any PADI training yet so I can not offer any opinion on the skill level attained after training.

I was an instructor at the Navy diving and salvage training center from 1999-2001 and now teach YMCA recreational diving.


Jeff Lane

 

[BradfordNC]

well, had something to say, but after that last post.....

damn, forgot