Pony Bottle attachment

[SCUBA482]

Hey all,

I've just mounted my 19cf pony to my hp100 using the "x bracket". Wondering if this configuration looks decent? I saw Dr. Bill's 13cf bottle attachment using a slightly different system and curious as to the strength and duration of the hose clamps? Are two necessary?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

Not a configuration i would use.. I put the pony on the right side, position the pony reg so that the hose comes off the reg vertically downward. This allows the pony hose to be routed under the right (not left) arm and up to your neck where you should use a necklace to mount the pony second stage.


Running the hose vertically downward keeps it from sticking out to the right side and the hose is very neat and protected running under your arm.

Also, putting it on the other side might make the pony bottle handle acesessible by reaching back around when wearing the rig. With the handle protruding backwards from behind the tank, as you have it now, it would be harder to manipulate underwater.

Also I don't see a gage on the pony, you want to have at least a small button guage that you chck every time before you hit the water.

Since it appears that you will never be really sure how much air is in the pony when you are actually diving ?(even with a button gage) it is highly advantageous to have the pony second stage on your neck, because a second stage freeflow will be impossible to ignore if it originates from around your neck; it is much easier to fail to notice if clipped of to the chest as typical of rec divers.


I do like how you have the body of the pony bottle reg positioned between the two bottles, which i think gives it the most protection.

Lastly, the two second stages look the same. People have died because they have started a dive on the pony, but thought it was the main, spit the reg our "switched" (but not really ) regs and put the empty pony reg back in and they have died. If you are going to use the same regs, try to put a weird or slightly uncomfortable mouthpiece on the pony, so that it is easily distinguishable from the primary reg..

 

[SCUBA482]

Not a configuration i would use.. I put the pony on the right side, position the pony reg so that the hose comes off the reg vertically downward. This allows the pony hose to be routed under the right (not left) arm and up to your neck where you should use a necklace to mount the pony second stage.


Running the hose vertically downward keeps it from sticking out to the right side and the hose is very neat and protected running under your arm.

Also, putting it on the other side might make the pony bottle handle acesessible by reaching back around when wearing the rig. With the handle protruding backwards from behind the tank, as you have it now, it would be harder to manipulate underwater.

Also I don't see a gage on the pony, you want to have at least a small button guage that you chck every time before you hit the water.

Since it appears that you will never be really sure how much air is in the pony when you are actually diving ?(even with a button gage) it is highly advantageous to have the pony second stage on your neck, because a second stage freeflow will be impossible to ignore if it originates from around your neck; it is much easier to fail to notice if clipped of to the chest as typical of rec divers.


I do like how you have the body of the pony bottle reg positioned between the two bottles, which i think gives it the most protection.

Lastly, the two second stages look the same. People have died because they have started a dive on the pony, but thought it was the main, spit the reg our "switched" (but not really ) regs and put the empty pony reg back in and they have died. If you are going to use the same regs, try to put a weird or slightly uncomfortable mouthpiece on the pony, so that it is easily distinguishable from the primary reg..

Thanks for your input. I wasn't quite sure, and still am not, how this "x bracket" was supposed to be mounted. The only way I could think to mount it to my system was on the left side because of the tank clasp that takes up the right side. I'll look at it again to make sure. Also, I just bought this setup today and was putting it together with the hose length that came with the Aqualung reg I bought. Speaking of which, the two 2nd stages do look similar in color, and I never considered that issue you mentioned ref pulling the wrong one, but I will add that they are two different regs for sure. The subtle differences may be hard to spot on my pics, but I'm pretty comfortable with which one is which before descent. While the mouthpieces are different now, I may buy a colored mouthpiece for the pony reg to make a distinct difference as you suggest.

Thanks for the idea of where to mount the pony 2nd stage. I hadn't thought of the pony free flow getting by me. Maybe it could still get past me if clipped to my right lapel strap just under my chin, but for sure not under my neck. This tip will also be useful ref the spg, or button gage should I experience a free flow from this 2nd stage.

Dr. Bill also has his pony mounted inverted on the right side of his tank. I am assuming this to be the "norm" for mounting a pony? I still routed my pony 2nd stage reg to the right side, but it's not under my arm. For now I chose to route it over my right shoulder and under a keeper on my BC. I will add that this does help keep my 2 regs from getting mixed up due to the hose lengths. I practiced with it tonight in my pool and was able to switch back and forth pretty easy. I think I like your suggestion of a longer hose length, tank mounted inverted, and running it under my arm though.

As for a spg, I am definitely going to make that addition. My plan with this pony is not to use it as part of my gas plan but to use it as my buddy if/when needed. I plan to start with it full and keep it full, with some use on my primary setup every once in a while just to change the air out. Even if I play in the pool with my kids with it to purge the air and get a fill to top it off. None the less a spg is in the future.

All this to say, THANKS Dumpsterdiver for the useful input and suggestions.

 

[4sak3n]

I plan to start with it full and keep it full, with some use on my primary setup every once in a while just to change the air out. Even if I play in the pool with my kids with it to purge the air and get a fill to top it off. None the less a spg is in the future.

The thing is ponies don't stay full for long at all. I lose about 10 bar (~147 psi) each and every dive with mine between checking the reg is working on the surface, practicing deploying it at depth to check no hoses are trapped and purging it to get the reg off. Now mine is a 40cf pony so yours will probably lose air through these type of things twice as fast.

It sounds like only a small amount but it rapidly adds up! If I do 5 dives with my pony I lose about 1/5 of all the air in it from this!

As you can see keeping it "full" will be a full time job. An SPG is DEFINITELY needed.

 

[micklock]

When I used a pony I had the pony mounted in the same position as you except the pony tank valve was facing the same way as the main tank valve and the pony reg hose was shorter and ran behind my neck over my right shoulder with the second stage on a necklace. If you click on the last pic here SCUBA Diving Equipment for Technical, Wreck and Cave Diving: Dive Rite, Inc - Product Catalog - Right Angle Adapter it will give you an idea of what it looks like.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

People generally mount the tank upside down, so that they can leave the tank valve off when diving and still access it very easily. This tehnique is designed to eliminate the possibility of a first stage leak or second stage free flow from draining the tank. The obvious draw back is that when you need it, the valve is off. I don't have a real strong position on that rgging, but I just put mine right side up and on and after thousands of dives it has worked fine.

I would NOT add a swivel to an emergency system if it is not needed. Elimination of failure points (as a swivel is) should be your goal, especially if it is unnecessary and does not improve your comfort.

Running the reg hose under your arm and to a neck lace strap IS THE WAY to do it, I am personally convinced of that. It is super clean and out of the way.. IIt is also the safest place to put the second stage. In an emergency, you will offer your primary to your buddy and you will use the pony. Also it is quite likely the buddy will snatch the reg he sees in your mouth, so you might as well go from that assumption and train and plan on using the pony in that situation and donating the primary reg from your mouth in all situations. That way you never have to remove the neck lanyard, defintely not something you want to mess with in an emergency.

 

[WD8CDH]

I would put the tank on the right too. I try to follow primary air knob in center, backup regulator (if using H valve) to my left and backup(redundant) Air supply on right.

Also, it looks like the bracket is backwards. The tighter radius curve should be against the pony and the shallow radius curve should be against the main tank.

The hose clamps are plenty strong and if all stainless steel, will last a long time. But you should still use 2 clamps as far apart as possible to prevent twisting.

 

[gndpdr]

honestly ...i mount my 19 centered on my al80 ...and no i'm not going into overhead with it mounted centered ....i just hate with a passion the lopsided feeling mounted left or right ....just me ....ok go ahead and flame me ....:

 

[WD8CDH]

honestly ...i mount my 19 centered on my al80 ...and no i'm not going into overhead with it mounted centered ....i just hate with a passion the lopsided feeling mounted left or right ....just me ....ok go ahead and flame me ....:

That would drive me crazy. I think even a bare 8" tank sticks out too far.

 

[SCUBA482]

Ok, I made a few changes, as you can see from the pics, based upon your input. I was able to adjust my tank strap over enough to get the (now properly mounted) "x bracket" on the right side (THANKS FOR CATCHING THAT). I still have the tank mounted with the valve up and may stay this way. I do like the inverted idea, but I will most likely be diving this configuration with the pony bottle valve turned on and ready to go so unless there is a much larger benefit to having it inverted other than being able to turn it on. I supposed the real issue suggested, which is a very valid point, is the prevention of a free flowing pony 2nd stage. What are your thoughts about being this close to the dump valve?

I will be buying a spg or button gauge later on today for the pony.

As for weighting: Having the Scubapro Classic Plus BCD, I have two trim pocket on the back. I obviously will not be able to access the side pocket very easily after the tank is on. How do you guys adjust the trim rolling issue? Does it sound reasonable to reduce the tank side by about 2lbs? Last night in my pool I had no weight in the one pocket on the side the tank was mounted to and only 2lbs on the opposite side. If I twisted while under water the roll wanted to take me to that side heavily, or so I thought since I am not used to it yet. With running a steel tank being neg 11lbs ish I don't need any, or very little, weight back there now.

I also included some pics of the two different 2nd stages. Both are the same color with subtle differences. I am considering changing the mouthpiece on the pony to a bright yellow to match the tank and id it as the pony reg.

Thoughts please?