The oral version workd.I love diving but dread the effects of seasickness. A few years ago I ordered some Stugeron, it worked about the same as the Bonine; slight relief, but not enough. Dramamine works a little better, but if I am diving an area with rougher seas, I have to use the Scopolamine patch. The down side is 1) keeping the patch in place after multiple days of diving 2) my pupils get dilated to the point of making me look like a total coke head. Not only an aesthetic issue, but it makes reading gauges difficult. 3) Complete cotton mouth which isn't such a big deal, but after diving, it would be nice to enjoy other activities without the parched mouth. However, I will still chose the side effects of the patch over seasickness. The oral version of Scopolamine sounds tempting. At least it would remove concerns over the patch slipping from the equation . Definitely will have to check that out
Prone to Sea Sickness? Cinnarizine!
- Thread starter deepsea21
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deepsea21
Contributor
I guess all I can say is thank God I am not overly susceptible to sea sickness and my wife who is can take Cinnarizine and it works for her. I've seen my share of sea sick people.. especially on long charter sport fishing trips to the Gulf Stream off the Outer Banks of NC and once the boat leaves, there's no coming back until the fishing is done. Vomiting til they are empty, then either sitting in a chair with eyes closed and heads bobbing turning green or laying on the floor in the salon when there's nothing left to throw up... horrible sickness and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy (well, yeah a would). I like what I am hearing about the Scopolamine patch to prevent sea sickness in those most susceptible to serious sickness.
With regard to that patch, I remember after being stung by a stingray with a serious puncture wound the Dr. told me I couldn't dive until it healed... Well, that wasn't going to happen with another trip booked and that was when I discovered the water-proof bandages in all sizes that totally seal the water out. I wonder if a large true waterproof bandage could fully cover this patch and allow it to perform UW as well as it does on land? No getting it wet, no screwing up its adhesive and trans-dermal qualities and just a matter of peeling off and replacing the large water-proof bandage you'd place over it when it's time to replace the patch?
With regard to that patch, I remember after being stung by a stingray with a serious puncture wound the Dr. told me I couldn't dive until it healed... Well, that wasn't going to happen with another trip booked and that was when I discovered the water-proof bandages in all sizes that totally seal the water out. I wonder if a large true waterproof bandage could fully cover this patch and allow it to perform UW as well as it does on land? No getting it wet, no screwing up its adhesive and trans-dermal qualities and just a matter of peeling off and replacing the large water-proof bandage you'd place over it when it's time to replace the patch?
Rred
Contributor
Nothing new here. There's a long list and history of antiemetic's aka seasickness meds and remedies and pretty much everyone agrees there is a process of going from weak to serious ones. You try the weak ones, if they don't work you keep escalating.
The acknowledged pros in the field happen to be NASA because seasick on a rowboat may be inconvenient, but seasick in a space capsule can mean death and disaster. They've found that plain ginger works because it is a "rubefacient" that is, it dilates the capillaries and gives you a ruddy flush. Dilating the capillaries increases capillary oxygen flow so there's some real science behind this. The drugstore meds all work for some people and not others, they're generally antihistamines and some of what is legal in the US is banned in the UK and vice versa. So while scopolamine was sold on the open racks in dive shops in the 80's, it went to rx only status, and the patches went off the market because nicotine patches were more profitable to manufacture. Then scop went off the US market entirely because they couldn't sell enough pills (Scopace) from the only maker, and patches are back. The FDA says that cinnarizine will kill you, the UK says it will solve your problems. Conversely, you can buy scop as Kwells and other brand names OTC in UK pharmacies, about $5 for a dozen pills. (Our dose used to be 4mg, theirs is 3mg regardless of brand.)
Personally, I find cin. is worthless and scop, despite many serious potential side effects, a wonder drug. I also have had less success with Neh-Kwan bands (elastic bands with acupressure buttons) and substantial relief with the electric "Relief Band" which is sold two ways, with replaceable batteries, or sealed with batteries good for 48-72 hours. It is FDA approved for morning sickness and when it is properly placed over the same acupressure points on the wrist, it delivers an electric shock that ranges from an adjustable tingle to "rats are chewing on me". But the damned thing works better than anything I've tried except scop, and I think I've tried everything short of Compazine enemas. (Which are a great idea if the victim can't take down a pill.)
NASA has their own "cocktail" (also erroneously credited to the USCG):
"25mg each of Ephedrine and Promethazine" the first being an antihistamine and the second there to keep you awake after the first hits you.(G) Their alternative was a scop nasal spray, which was supposed to be licensed for public sale in 2012 but still pending.
Bottom line for ANY of the serious meds? Read carefully. Ask your doctor. And TRY IT AT HOME like on Saturday morning, so you'll have a whole day ahead of you where you can get help if you have a bad reaction. Trying new stuff on a boat, especially a dive boat, is not a good idea.
Cinnarizine? You could buy Stugeron OTC at any WalMart across the border in Canada back when I tried it. Worked about as well as aspirin, for me.
The acknowledged pros in the field happen to be NASA because seasick on a rowboat may be inconvenient, but seasick in a space capsule can mean death and disaster. They've found that plain ginger works because it is a "rubefacient" that is, it dilates the capillaries and gives you a ruddy flush. Dilating the capillaries increases capillary oxygen flow so there's some real science behind this. The drugstore meds all work for some people and not others, they're generally antihistamines and some of what is legal in the US is banned in the UK and vice versa. So while scopolamine was sold on the open racks in dive shops in the 80's, it went to rx only status, and the patches went off the market because nicotine patches were more profitable to manufacture. Then scop went off the US market entirely because they couldn't sell enough pills (Scopace) from the only maker, and patches are back. The FDA says that cinnarizine will kill you, the UK says it will solve your problems. Conversely, you can buy scop as Kwells and other brand names OTC in UK pharmacies, about $5 for a dozen pills. (Our dose used to be 4mg, theirs is 3mg regardless of brand.)
Personally, I find cin. is worthless and scop, despite many serious potential side effects, a wonder drug. I also have had less success with Neh-Kwan bands (elastic bands with acupressure buttons) and substantial relief with the electric "Relief Band" which is sold two ways, with replaceable batteries, or sealed with batteries good for 48-72 hours. It is FDA approved for morning sickness and when it is properly placed over the same acupressure points on the wrist, it delivers an electric shock that ranges from an adjustable tingle to "rats are chewing on me". But the damned thing works better than anything I've tried except scop, and I think I've tried everything short of Compazine enemas. (Which are a great idea if the victim can't take down a pill.)
NASA has their own "cocktail" (also erroneously credited to the USCG):
"25mg each of Ephedrine and Promethazine" the first being an antihistamine and the second there to keep you awake after the first hits you.(G) Their alternative was a scop nasal spray, which was supposed to be licensed for public sale in 2012 but still pending.
Bottom line for ANY of the serious meds? Read carefully. Ask your doctor. And TRY IT AT HOME like on Saturday morning, so you'll have a whole day ahead of you where you can get help if you have a bad reaction. Trying new stuff on a boat, especially a dive boat, is not a good idea.
Cinnarizine? You could buy Stugeron OTC at any WalMart across the border in Canada back when I tried it. Worked about as well as aspirin, for me.
Gdog
Contributor
Straight Meclizine tablets work wonders for me.
Rred
Contributor
AFAIK Meclizine, Bonine, Dramamine, and Dramaine II are all the same active ingredient now, which is Meclizine. Once upon a time some of them were different, and equally in/effective, but today they are all supposed to be the same.
The first time I was offshore and the wx turned really foul, someone said "Here, take two and have some Ritz crackers." Note: Imitation Butter Flavor Ritz crackers are a greasy insult to the stomach, and two tablets can put you to sleep for 18 hours. It was a very long night.
The first time I was offshore and the wx turned really foul, someone said "Here, take two and have some Ritz crackers." Note: Imitation Butter Flavor Ritz crackers are a greasy insult to the stomach, and two tablets can put you to sleep for 18 hours. It was a very long night.
Not sure the Epi pen pricing is the FDA's issue, but an issue it is.
Side question (sorry), maybe you guys know: So what do Epi pens go for outside of the US and how to buy them?
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A few observations from an experienced offshore sailor:
- There are three basic grades of seasickness:
Grade 1: you feel sick but can still function
Grade 2: you are sick enough that you feel like you might die if it doesn't go away
Grade 3: you are sick enough that you want to die to make it go away
Grade 2: you are sick enough that you feel like you might die if it doesn't go away
Grade 3: you are sick enough that you want to die to make it go away
- No one type of treatment works universally for everyone. Do not believe anyone who claims otherwise ... their sample size is too small or they are not objective.
- Oral medicinal treatments must be started well before becoming seasick. Why? Because medicine doesn't work after you throw it up and out of your body. Usual practice is to start 1-2 dosage periods before being exposed to motion. Usually that means starting the medicine the day before the boat trip.
- Most seasickness medicines have side effects. These can include dry mouth, vision disturbances, anxiety, drowsiness, and so on.
- Testing the medicine when onshore and not subject to seasickness will allow you to separate the effects of seasickness from the side effects of the medicine, and allow you to choose a medicine that you can tolerate the side effects of. Reducing the dosage can reduce the side effects.
- There are many non-medicinal treatments including some which are arguably placebos. What matters is finding something that works for you.
- On longer boat trips, i.e. multiple days, almost everyone adapts and gets over their initial seasickness. Almost everyone ... The rest are not having fun.
- When you feel like you are over the risk of seasickness, try reducing the dosage by half and see if you continue feeling OK; if so, try discontinuing the medication.
- Beware dehydration.
Rred
Contributor
Perhaps we just called it "epinephrine" not "epi pen" but in the 70's they were a whopping $20 cash. Today, YOU CAN STILL BUY THEM FOR $20 CASH. Not the fancy auto-injection slammer, but a prefilled syringe with epinephrine, same drug, same effect. The difference is that you will have to remove the cover form the needle and press the syringe handle yourself.
Yes, the EpiPen(R) price is outrageous. Even more shocking, is that the people who think they need it, forget there really is a $20 alternative. Unless you're four years old and the syringe concept is too difficult...Ask your doctor or pharmacist to find you the $20 option, and tell the folks who make the EpiPen where they can shove it.
Gdog
Contributor
ScubaALC
New
I was hoping someone may have a suggestion for myself. I have never gotten seasick on the boat heading to the dive site. I only get seasick during my safety stop at the end of my dive, which if I was finished diving wouldn't be a problem, but usually we just head out to a different location. When I have gone diving with a dive company, I have completely stumped the guides, as they had not come across the situation before. I have tried Dramamine, Ginger capsules, chewing on ginger, Divertigo (homeopathic oil), OTC patches, as well as magnet bracelets that apply accupressure to prevent seasickness. Does anyone have the same problem they have overcome or any suggestions?
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