Ready to purchase? Legend vs MK17

[Charged]

Ive narrowed my interests to purchasing either of these setups. Im requesting the expertise of you folks to ensure thats my best selection. Im also open to other makes/models...so long as my LDS's sell them.

A little about myself and diving intentions:
Im a 6'2" 28 year old male weighing 200pds with no body fat. Lung functioning is normal. I tend to take deep slow breaths underwater. I intend to dive inland fresh waters of my residential state of KY. Saltwaters of the US coastal region and Carribean. Well...lets be honest, wherever I can dive, Ill dive. I currently hold an OW SSI certification, but plan to increase that knowledge to Nitrox, wreck, etc. I also intend on purchasing a steel HP100 tank.

Although Im financially comfortable, Im NOT wealthy. I dont feel like drowning, so I dont intend to settle for whats "good for the money". I want something that I wont die with. I can save up and purchase another day if need be.

• First-Stage Scubapro MK17MK17 - SCUBAPRO-UWATEC)
  with
  Second-Stage Scubapro G250V: (G250V - SCUBAPRO-UWATEC)

The above two items (1st & 2nd stages) are sold together as a pcakage deal for $540.00

• Octopus Scubapro R295 $145.00: (R295 OCTOPUS - SCUBAPRO-UWATEC)

This next option Im going to present is going to be from a different store:

• First-Stage AND Second-Stage Aqua~Lung Legend ACD $495.00Legend ACD)
  
• Octopus Aqua~Lung Legend $207.00Legend Octopus)

Thank you so much!

PS: I lean towards the Scubapro, especially after seeing all those stickie threads on Aqua~Lung recalls.

 

[John_B]

I think you'll find that most people will recommend what they already own.

I have Apeks XTX-100s which have been very solid, I've been very happy with them. My one local dive buddy and I had a fairly dramatic freeflow incident in cold water with his Scubapro MK25/S600s, he has since sold those and bought the MK17/G250Vs which have been flawless.

If I were buying more regs, it would definitely be either Apeks XTX-100s or the Scubapro MK17/G250Vs, especially if cold water (40°F) dives are in the cards. Why? Because they are what I have ready access to and from experience I know that I would be more than thrilled with either choice.

One thing I would personally recommend (and again, responses will be all over the map on this), if you are the getting the MK17/G250V then go ahead and get another G250V for your alternate vs. the R295.

PS: I lean towards the Scubapro, especially after seeing all those stickie threads on Aqua~Lung recalls.

Don't think for a New York minute that Scubapro/Uwatec haven't had their share of recalls. The most important thing about recalls is how quickly they fess up to the problem and how hassle-free the fixes are for existing customers. The search engine at CPSC.gov is fairly robust, search on "Scubapro" and "Uwatec" in your spare time before jumping to any conclusions.

 

[FrankPro1]

I originally wanted the G250/Mk17 setup, but because my local LDS wouldn't service Scubapro's diaphragm 1rst stages, I went with the Legend lx. Either reg is perfectly suited for cold water and are great reliable performers. I personally would prefer to have the G250v 2nd stage over the Legend's, mainly because of its use of metal. If you can get it serviced I'd go with the Scubapro, but I doubt you could tell the difference when breathing off the two. Go with the brand that gets your juices flowing Either way you'll have a great reg.

 

[Charged]

Thanks to BOTH of you guys so far!

Yes, I searched Scubapro on cpsc.gov as suggested and it did turn back results. Luckily, none about the products in question.

*EDIT*
Just noticed this, Scubapro has a button on their own website dedicated to recalls, consumer alerts, etc.
http://www.scubapro.com/americas/english/product-support/warranty-and-repairs/consumer-alerts.aspx
*END EDIT*

...If you can get it serviced I'd go with the Scubapro..."

Yes, the Scubapro rep told me that parts are free for every annual inspection. I just have to pay the labor which he said is generally around $60 if I recall correct. Does that price seem typical? He also said that they give it a complete overhaul regardless. This is the same setup that our local police and fire use.

 

[FrankPro1]

parts are free for every annual inspection.

Parts are free for both Scubapro and Aqualung "as long as you get it serviced every year". As far as labor prices my LDS charges 15$ a stage.

 

[Charged]

John B:
What sort of "freeflow problem" occured with your friends Scubapro MK25/S600s? Would you expect it again as a possibiliy on a regulator like the one Im interested in?

You also mentioned the employment of an additional G250V for use as an octopus as opposed to the R295. Why exactly? I realize the G is better, but just how better must an octopus be?

FrankPro1:
You mentioned that you prefer the metal used on the Scubapro G250V. With this exception, why else do you prefer this regulator over the Aqua~Lung Legend? How do you feel about the ACD of the Legends first-stage? Is there an ACD type device on the Scubapro MK17 so I wont goof up and get contaminants threw my first-stage?

Thanks again!

 

[keyshunter]

Frankpro1,
I am curious about you comment about metal in the second stages of SP vs AL Legend. The SP 250v marks a return from a plastic to a metal air barrel, which the Legend second (and the Apeks) has always had. Do you have information which disproves this?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Both are great regs. Personally I prefer the Mk 17 as I like the dry sealed ambient chamber. No mess no fuss and works extremely well even in 35 degree water. On the Legend you need to add the "supreme" option.

The Legend LX second stage uses what amounts to the old two piece metal and plastic balanced SP poppet (Aqualung calls it a shuttle valve) redone in a one piece all plastic version along the lines of what SP did when they re-designed with a one piece all plastic but much more streamlined shape. In that regard, the Aqulung poppet is a good imitation of the old SP poppet.

Also the G250V uses a metal air barrel that passes all the way through the case with a splined nut on one end and a splined all metal adjustment knob on the other. The increased surface area improves heat transfer over the Legend's second stage.

All in all I prefer the MK 17 G250V but would settle for the Legend in the event I could not get a Mk 17.

I originally wanted the G250/Mk17 setup, but because my local LDS wouldn't service Scubapro's diaphragm 1rst stages, I went with the Legend lx. Either reg is perfectly suited for cold water and are great reliable performers. I personally would prefer to have the G250v 2nd stage over the Legend's, mainly because of its use of metal. If you can get it serviced I'd go with the Scubapro, but I doubt you could tell the difference when breathing off the two. Go with the brand that gets your juices flowing Either way you'll have a great reg.

I have heard similar stories from a couple other people. For decades SP promoted the suiperiority of piston regs and at the same time pretty much bashed the whole idea of a diaphragm reg. In the distant past (1970's maybe) there was some degree of truth to it and if nothing else the old MK 5 and Mk 10 designs were simple with low parts counts and superb reliability. However diaphragm designs have come along way and I replaced my Mk 25's with Mk 17's a few years ago and have never regretted it - especially given the limited reliability of the Mk 25 in water colder than about 45 degrees.

From a technician perspective the Mk 17 is not any harder to service - just a bit different, but the issue may be one of a fossilized shop owner not wanting to learn any new tricks. In any case that sort of ignorance is more than enough reason to find a new shop.

 

[FrankPro1]

On the Legend you need to add the "supreme" option.

Why the Supreme? I thought that it was just a lower ip and lip shield? Doesn't the regular legend have just as good cold water performance?

For decades SP promoted the suiperiority of piston regs and at the same time pretty much bashed the whole idea of a diaphragm reg. From a technician perspective the Mk 17 is not any harder to service - just a bit different, but the issue may be one of a fossilized shop owner not wanting to learn any new tricks. In any case that sort of ignorance is more than enough reason to find a new shop.

My LDS has been around for over thirty years and I think you hit it on the mark. The tech was actually pushing me towards diaphragm regs because I do shore diving but said "if you want Scubapro go piston, its what they do best". Though they might have old "fossilized" views on regs, I really respect and admire the group they have working there. There shop is very professional and the most well stocked in the area. There prices are also the lowest in Los Angeles that I could find. One of the first allures as a non diver to the place for me was the various shots they had of the tech and shop owner serving as dive masters in the Galapagos for one of Jean Michel Cousteau's expeditions. For me there are various reasons why I decided to stick with them, but I understand there view on the Scubapro is extremely out dated.

Frankpro1,
I am curious about you comment about metal in the second stages of SP vs AL Legend. The SP 250v marks a return from a plastic to a metal air barrel, which the Legend second (and the Apeks) has always had. Do you have information which disproves this?

I was always thought that the G250's internals were littered with metal.... Please correct me if I'm wrong.... I'm very new to the technical side of regulators.

John B:
What sort of "freeflow problem" occured with your friends Scubapro MK25/S600s? Would you expect it again as a possibiliy on a regulator like the one Im interested in?

You also mentioned the employment of an additional G250V for use as an octopus as opposed to the R295. Why exactly? I realize the G is better, but just how better must an octopus be?

FrankPro1:
You mentioned that you prefer the metal used on the Scubapro G250V. With this exception, why else do you prefer this regulator over the Aqua~Lung Legend? How do you feel about the ACD of the Legends first-stage? Is there an ACD type device on the Scubapro MK17 so I wont goof up and get contaminants threw my first-stage?

Thanks again!

I wouldn't make the ACD feature a priority. Though I don't think its a bad idea, I just wouldn't put it on the top of my list when picking regulators.

 

[John_B]

What sort of "freeflow problem" occured with your friends Scubapro MK25/S600s? Would you expect it again as a possibiliy on a regulator like the one Im interested in?

This freeflow happened with an MK25 unsealed piston first stage on a cold water dive. It occurred at 60' during our descent when my buddy hit his inflator with a single long blast to slow his descent (force of habit). The innards of the piston first stage froze open due to adiabatic cooling. (Leave the valve open on a full tank for a minute to get a feel for how this works.) The only solution was to shut off the valve and give the first stage time to thaw.

This is not a problem for a sealed diaphragm first stage like the MK17, most of the Apeks XTX line (exception being the XTX-20 which is unique in that it has an unsealed diaphragm design) or the Legend you are looking at. FWIW, better technique goes a long way toward mitigating this kind of event.

You also mentioned the employment of an additional G250V for use as an octopus as opposed to the R295. Why exactly? I realize the G is better, but just how better must an octopus be?

If its good enough for you, why shouldn't you get something as good for your buddy. And if you ever decide to try the long hose/bungeed backup configuration, you'd be all set; you could configure it for the cost of a couple of hoses.

IMO, stay away from gimicks like the Aqualung ACD or the Apeks Status. Most of the new stuff in scuba is nothing more than gimmicks to sell gear to new students. Look at the gear of divers who have been diving for two decades and have a thousand+ dives; they'll have good quality stuff but it will usually not be the most expensive or have the latest gizmos or widgets tacked on (like elevator levers on BCDs or self-closing valves on regulators).